| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| MisterX |
Posted - 02 Jun 2013 : 03:48:48
Hello there!
In my Drow-Campaign, I (als DM) encountered the following problem, now requesting some help and maybe lore here:
The party consists of a female fighter (going to be cleric of loth in a few levels), a female fighter/rogue, a female factotum (dungeonscape), a male sorcerer/wizard, a male cleric of selvetarm and a male ranger. All of them chose Lolth for their patron (except, for obvious reasons, the Selvetargtlin; but since Selvetarm himself is a servant of Lolth…). All of them are of evil alignment (except the factotum which could be chaotic neutral, I think).
At the moment, they're adventuring the underdark, crawling a dungeon some days away from the city they call home. That dungeon is a century-old maze which used to be a city of a big tribe of minotaurs. Now, that the minotaurs are gone, its just a monster-infested, vast maze, inhabited by a goblin-tribe, adventured by a group of minotaur-adventures (who seek the same treasure, the party hopes to find) and – of course – the ghosts of the former inhabitants, haunting the region.
At the end of the last session, the ranger died. He was, sad to say, eaten (literally) by a Behir strolling around (yepp, random encounter…).
Now, the party wants to resurrect the ranger. This is to the out-game reason, that i accidently killed that character now for the second time (it was an accident! really!) and that it (in-game) might be useful to have a ranger among your group when adventuring in a minotaur-maze…
The problem is that their cleric lacks the level for resurrection-spells. And now, without their ranger, the party is stuck in the maze.
Now the ranger is at the Fugue Plane, awaiting Kelemvor's judgement.
So, how do I get out of this? I don't want to block role-play just for the rules' sake, on the other hand I don't want to make it too easy, neither. I thought of having a mini-plot out of this, but am stuck in the details. I could imagine some plane-travel, but to 'steal' a soul from the Fugue Plane would require the help of gods or demons. Why should one intervene? Maybe one other god of the drow-pantheon could try to 'convert' them – but Selvetarm had no reason for this, they're too evil for Eilistraee to be interesting, they hate Kiaransalee and I personally don't like Ghaundaur… Also, in the sight of the gods, the ranger failed – and thus doesn't deserve to live…
Any ideas? |
| 23 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| MisterX |
Posted - 07 Oct 2013 : 18:08:32
You wanted to be kept in the loop – so here's how it went (also: warning – mature content):
I told you the remaining tests were the tests of hatred, beliefs and treason, but I mixed them up a bit (which ended up great, in my opinion).
Before the gaming would start, I took out the five other players and told them that they now would act as NPCs for me. I allocated one of the Drow gods Lolth, Eilistrae, Kiaransalee, Selvetarm and Vhearaun to each player (Ghaunadaur was missing because the group consists of six players in total, I didn't want to play an NPC myself in that scene and I don't like Ghaunadaur very much as a drow-god) and were told to try to convince the ranger to choose them as his ally. They were told to ignore each other as if their respective NPC was the only simulated "aspect" in the room and to stop interacting when the ranger turned to talk to the next NPC. The ranger had to choose which one of them (or their dogmas) suited him best as an ally; choosing any one except Lolth or Selvetarm would mean failing the test in Lolth's eyes, of course.
When we began I told him he saw a door with the text "Choose your ally wisely" and then he entered a room with nothing but the five NPCs within. He listened to the descriptions the players choose for their NPCs appearances and without talking to any of them he chose the representation of Selvetarm "for he looks like he'd be useful in battle". Took him ten seconds or so and was a little frustrating (in a smiling and head-shaking way) for the players because we were sure he would have ended up with either Vheraun or Eilistraee if he had talked to the NPCs.
Then followed the tests of hatred and treason. They group (now complete, not only the ranger as in the "room" before) entered another plain room with only two portals in it. One led to a quiet little cave with a Lolth-Shrine in it, the second to the surface, directly inside an elven shrine where a group of mages and clerics were about to heal another elf magically. For a short while they debated which portal to choose and (completely correctly) ended up with the decision that they would serve Lolth better in killing the hated elves. When I designed the test I thought that the test was passed by going through the portal to the surface, but then they made up the plan to get through, capture at least one of the elves, kill the rest and go back through the portal, then go to the small shrine and sacrifice the captive. So: Even better than I thought of.
That's when I decided to put in a little combat as well as the test of treason: When they went through the portal, the ranger got the instruction that one Drow had to die as well. So he had to betray his allies just because of Lolth's commands. Well, he did. But.
First they slayed the elves (starting with a fireball from the mage directly on the sick, then charges…) and captured one of them. Then they got back and through the other portal. While the clerics (I have one of Lolth, one of Selvetarm) prepared the sacrifice, the ranger sneaked up behind another drow, said "This sacrifice doesn't look complete. There's something missing." and slit the throat of a team-member to cover the elf-to-be-sacrificed in blood.
This ended the tests. The group awoke on the battleground they'd left before Selvetarm "hammered" them to Lolth's little test-site. The Avatar of Selvetarm was still there, reached into (!) the body of each of the party-members and ripped some life-force out to imbue the ranger with it. So, for every class-level of the ranger, he ripped out a level of one of the players (resurrection has its costs!). The characters gained a negative level (represented by a malus of -1 to all rolls except damage rolls) which will last until they cast remove curse and restoration. Of course, the ranger is unaffected.
Well, it was a sub-plot of very intense role-playing and I like to thank you all again for your inspiring posts. It ended up something completely different than you proposed and I planned, but it surely would not have ended this great if you didn't support me. Thanks! |
| Emma Drake |
Posted - 27 Aug 2013 : 18:52:34
quote:
Originally posted by MisterX
quote:
Originally posted by Emma Drake
I was really hoping this would end in reincarnation. I'd love to see what the other drow PCs would do if the dead PC came back as a goblin, deep gnome, etc.!
Will do this with the next dead PC, I suppose. The ranger is just the wrong character/player for such a plot.
In my home game, we recently reincarnated a male human PC and he came back as a female halfling. Hilarity ensued. |
| MisterX |
Posted - 27 Aug 2013 : 18:51:06
quote:
Originally posted by Emma Drake
I was really hoping this would end in reincarnation. I'd love to see what the other drow PCs would do if the dead PC came back as a goblin, deep gnome, etc.!
Will do this with the next dead PC, I suppose. The ranger is just the wrong character/player for such a plot. |
| Emma Drake |
Posted - 27 Aug 2013 : 18:16:43
quote:
Originally posted by sleyvas
just in case you run into a similar case again, one thing that you might want to consider in the future is having the players run across an NPC spirit shaman (or rather an NPC spirit shaman coming to them because the "dead" PC won't leave him alone). He should be very "uncultured", but he should "see the spirit" of whatever player you want to bring back. Let it be something like a séance, with the spirit shaman talking to the dead PC and translating to players. He should be irritated with both sides and offer to "bring the spirit back to the mortal realm", but only if the players do something for him. Whenever they do, he then reincarnates the PC. What he comes back as could be interesting... surface elf, orc, kobold, troglodyte... I'd throw in some different options as well for the underdark, such as quaggoth, derro, duergar, deep gnome
I was really hoping this would end in reincarnation. I'd love to see what the other drow PCs would do if the dead PC came back as a goblin, deep gnome, etc.! |
| sleyvas |
Posted - 27 Aug 2013 : 18:11:58
just in case you run into a similar case again, one thing that you might want to consider in the future is having the players run across an NPC spirit shaman (or rather an NPC spirit shaman coming to them because the "dead" PC won't leave him alone). He should be very "uncultured", but he should "see the spirit" of whatever player you want to bring back. Let it be something like a séance, with the spirit shaman talking to the dead PC and translating to players. He should be irritated with both sides and offer to "bring the spirit back to the mortal realm", but only if the players do something for him. Whenever they do, he then reincarnates the PC. What he comes back as could be interesting... surface elf, orc, kobold, troglodyte... I'd throw in some different options as well for the underdark, such as quaggoth, derro, duergar, deep gnome |
| Emma Drake |
Posted - 27 Aug 2013 : 16:51:45
Sounds like a lot of fun! Keep us updated as you proceed. :) |
| MisterX |
Posted - 27 Aug 2013 : 15:09:19
In short: Very good! They took the first possibility and are still working on the tests.
Long story:
As always, players like to smash the ideas of DMs at first encounter - and then it usually goes epic. Same last time. I cut the scene the weekend before the last weekend immediately after the ranger died and subsequently told my players off-game some info according to their character's knowledge. Those with ranks in Knowledge (Planes) were given info on the Fugue-Plane (and how or how not to escape from there), those with ranks in Knowledge (Arcane) were given the fact that it would require a 9th level arcane spell to resurrect dead, those with Spellcraft heard that it was possible (but very dangerous) to engage in cooperating spell-weaving with divine magic-users and those with Knowledge (Religion) were told that both Lolth or Selvetarm sometimes grant great favours when caught in the right mood and given an appropriate sacrifice. The party has a (male) cleric of Selvetarm (multiclassed with barbarian) and a fighter who just took her first level as a cleric of Lolth. Both prepared the corpse for a spell, drawing magic signs (with blood) to canalize magic energies (had them roll on spellcraft on this, iirc) and then – the cleric of Selvetarm started roaring and shouting. In the midst of a dungeon-crawl. Of a dungeon-crawl full of monsters. Well… yes.
Clever idea, because he provoked a completely useless fight for the hell of it while the party was weakened by the death of a member and the fight beforehand. They were caught in a dead-end, had to preserve the corpse (if they still wanted to resurrect the dead character) and were a bit out-of-supply when it came to spells, for example… So in conclusion: They started a fight which they probably would lose just for the sake of spilling blood. Selvetarm likes those things… When the player told me his character would fanatically begin praying while hitting the Deathkiss-Beholderkin I let loose on them (two or three levels above their regular CR at full strength, iirc), I knew this would be sufficient for Selvetarm. So, when they finally (and very fast due to luck on their side and many natural '1' on the monster's) killed the monster, an aspect of Selvetarm appeared – and without a word or a comment started to literally bash the characters into the abyss (I just thought that being hit by a 10ft fighter-drow clad in full-plate armor would be a more appropriate image of a planeshift induced by Selvetarm than any portal or dimensional door would be…) where they awoke in a strange place.
Before the session started, I had given the player of the dead ranger a questionnaire with several keywords (emotions, values, principles, feelings etc) and told him to quickly associate every keyword with the first three things the character would think of. Using this paper I made up the environment of the "rooms" on the fly - designed to resemble the characters feelings associated with the test he faced. E.g. for the word "strength" he wrote "fight" and "monster" – and thus, within a test of strength, he had to – yeah, correct. Fight monsters. Totally surprising.
The dead ranger awoke in a small pocket-dimension of Lolths layer of the abyss (she hasn't been silent, yet) and was faced with tests while the rest of the group - who wanted him back - could assist him. They were told by Lolth to prove worthiness - or suffer (with some exceptions because other characters, her cleric for example, are also "tested" within a major plot line). So, that was the beginning, followed by some tests.
First, they encountered the test of will. Lolth favours those with a strong will to survive and to conquer and so this has been the major part of the test. The group found itself within a hostile environment (some underdark-jungle) and was constantly attacked while the environment was altered sub-conciously by the ranger (whose test was to detect that he could actively control and shape the environment by force of will). Doing this, I did not face the players with threats on my own but just reacted. For example when the ranger asked if there were monsters – yes, there were monsters. If he was searching for a hidden passage – there was a hidden passage. If he told me that his character would scout ahead to see if there were powerful monsters ahead – well, you know how it goes. To keep the story short, he finally told me a plan how he would silently scout the whole cave to look for a possibility to escape.
Next, they faced the test of strength and the test of skills. I had not decided on a specific order of these two tests and decided that the group could choose which one they would prefer (just to face the other one next). They stood before two doors which were ornated with all kinds of monsters devouring each other (strength) and plants and environmental obstacles (skill). They took this for a riddle and for nearly half an hour discussed which would be the right door to choose (Great scene! I love my players!). They chose the monsters and were confronted with six monsters (for six characters) in a room who were turned to stone and just started fighting (then turned to flesh, of course) when attacked. The monsters ranged in the challenge-rating from 1 to 6 (the group is lvl 6, ECL 8, now) Draw-Back: For each fight the group started, I randomly chose one character to replace a smashed statue, thus reducing the fighting-capacities of the group, rendering further fights harder. Also, the monsters had to be slain by the ranger to be tested, not by the fighters or a spell. If they were slain by another member of the party, their hitpoints were to be restored completely… Lolth values individual strength and Lolth values cooperation. They chose to display both when doing subdual damage first, fighting the monsters one-by-one and then letting the ranger coup-de-grace them, when the fighting was done. The ranger proceeded to the next room (test of skills) where he had to face a small labyrinth relying on his ranger-skills (jumping, climbing, stuff like that).
After that came the tests of evil and chaos which took place in the same room. A few words beforhand are necessary: First, only two characters are chaotic-evil in alignment. Two are neutral-evil, one is chaotic-neutral and one even lawful-evil (aiming to take levels in the Fang of Lolth PrC (3.5e DotU). But because the ranger was chaotic-evil, the dimenion was, too. So any character not of chaotic-evil alignment felt uncomfortable and sometimes even faced penalties on certain rolls. The room of the tests of evil and chaos were different: This part of the pocket-plane was completely neutral-aligned and part of the test was to change that back to chaotic-evil by force of will (see test of will). The ranger failed on the "chaotic" side, but did his job when it came to the "evil" part. Within the room were three severly wounded Astral Devas chained in golden cages who begged the party to release them. When they refused but instead moved on to kill them, a fourth Deva with two Eladrin came to help. I already told you that the group has an ECL of 8 but a Deva has an CR of 14 – secure death. But at the start of the tests (by the doors, actually) I had given the ranger a magical whip (resembling the famous snake-whips but with only one head) which was capable of controlling creatures it hit. So he hit the Angel (creature of pure lawful-goodness) – and then commanded him to slay all the other angels. This act of evil and chaos resulted in passing these tests.
There we cut. They now have to face the tests of hatred, beliefs and treason, but I'm looking forward to it. It was a VERY intense weekend of gaming, and definately one of my better days as a DM.
So, again: Thanks for your help and great inspiration, much of this weekend, I owe to you, Candlekeep! ;) |
| Emma Drake |
Posted - 26 Aug 2013 : 22:59:56
How did it go? |
| The Arcanamach |
Posted - 14 Aug 2013 : 20:50:33
I like your pocket dimension idea but why would Lloth waste time/energy creating a separate dimension for the test? I would think she would just have some spot reserved for doing the test somewhere on her home plane. Also, I don't see her personally over seeing such tests but rather her yochlol would do it. I'm assuming that yochlol are former priestesses rewarded with that form in the afterlife. One other note, I would think the test should require at least 5 (of 8) passing to be rewarded (in other words, her followers must be above average to gain her favor). |
| MisterX |
Posted - 14 Aug 2013 : 14:48:55
The next Drow-Weekend is running near and – just for the sake of completeness and maybe some improving comments from your side – I'll just roughly sketch out my ideas on the subject:
The first possibility for the character to come back, is a "ritual" (as in: free-style spellcasting hoping to achieve effects similar to a raise dead spell) performed by the rest of the group (who, as I already pointed out, have some interest to bring the character back to life). This will result in Lolth testing the faith of the group and the worthiness of the dead character: She will build up a pocket-dimension after the personality of the deceased character and will test him in eight single subtests. If he manages to survive and pass at least four tests, he will be brought back. If he dies during the tests, its up to the rest of the group to decide if he will be brought back to life (group passes tests) but be (temporarily) transformed to a Drider (he still failed in the eyes of Lolth!) or if he stays dead (group fails, too). If he passes all eight tests, there will of course be a reward for him. ;)
The second possibility, if the group fails at the ritual or refrains from performing it, he will be approached by demons for being proposed an offer he cannot resist. See posts above for details, I'll improvise this scene but will definetly be inspired by the posts above.
The third possibility is a second group of adventurers whom to place in the dungeon I planned from the beginning. I decided that they have a scroll of resurrection (or raise dead or whatever I deem appropriate in the moment I introduce the scene) the PCs can buy or swap or loot.
If neither of the possibilities is tried or works – well, then both character and group clearly deserves the death. ;)
Thanks for your inspiration (and maybe some final comment before I start running the scenes on friday)! |
| MisterX |
Posted - 04 Jun 2013 : 23:49:35
In unrelated news, my players came up with the "Resurrection as punishment" on their own. ;) |
| MisterX |
Posted - 04 Jun 2013 : 08:06:32
quote:
Originally posted by TheLemming
quote:
Originally posted by MisterX
The "Reincarnate"-idea, is just great. I think I might just do that. I'm not sure how I "explain" that in terms of "in-game-logic" (you know, the fluff), but it's at the top of the "might happen"-list. THANKS A LOT!
Also, Emma, I like the "punishment"-factor very much. I hope that my players get that idea, too. Would ease their way very much. :)
Why don't you discuss it with your cleric's player if he likes the idea. It potentially grants the opportunity for him to RP this whole situation or negotiation for his character. He could do this with the consent of the rest of the group or do it because of his own motives.
I will of course discuss the whole matter with each of the players, but won't show them any way out. I just give slight hints and let the players get their own solutions for their problems. Usually, they come up with better ideas than I do, anyway. But in general, the situation at hands is a perfect "riddle" for the players to solve on their own, in my opinion. What I discuss here, is my fall-back solution. It's going to be a pretty good, in any way, so if the players ask the right questions, I might also outright tell them, while playing. ;) |
| TheLemming |
Posted - 04 Jun 2013 : 07:17:15
quote:
Originally posted by MisterX
The "Reincarnate"-idea, is just great. I think I might just do that. I'm not sure how I "explain" that in terms of "in-game-logic" (you know, the fluff), but it's at the top of the "might happen"-list. THANKS A LOT!
Also, Emma, I like the "punishment"-factor very much. I hope that my players get that idea, too. Would ease their way very much. :)
Why don't you discuss it with your cleric's player if he likes the idea. It potentially grants the opportunity for him to RP this whole situation or negotiation for his character. He could do this with the consent of the rest of the group or do it because of his own motives. |
| MisterX |
Posted - 03 Jun 2013 : 23:30:28
Well, I think most of my players don't even know Candlekeep exists. ;) But to the fluff:
The "Reincarnate"-idea, is just great. I think I might just do that. I'm not sure how I "explain" that in terms of "in-game-logic" (you know, the fluff), but it's at the top of the "might happen"-list. THANKS A LOT!
Also, Emma, I like the "punishment"-factor very much. I hope that my players get that idea, too. Would ease their way very much. :)
@xaeyruudh: I'll read through the Sorrowsworn Demon in the MM3. Sounds very cool, I think I can make something out of that. |
| Emma Drake |
Posted - 03 Jun 2013 : 20:10:06
quote:
Originally posted by xaeyruudh
Reincarnate brings people back as other humanoid races now? Weird.
Yup. I mention that assuming the OP is playing 3.X, 2e is the edition with all of the animals as possibilities. If he's playing 2e, the same problems apply to reincarnate as to resurrection - they're both 7th level spells and the cleric isn't high enough level to cast them.
In 3.X, Reincarnate offers humanoids and a few 1% chance monstrous humanoids as possible new bodies. Roll on a table, see what you get. Oooh, drow lizardman! Heh. Of course, the DM can just decide what to use as well.
I'm particularly keen on Reincarnate right now. One of my fellow adventurers in our campaign just did something to royally pooch the party and then died. We want to bring him back but punish him a little bit and have decided to have him reincarnated. He may come back as an even more awesome/powerful race than he is, or he could end up as something he doesn't want. Seems like a fitting penance. "Good news, buddy, you're not dead! Bad news is, you're a bugbear. Enjoy. And maybe take a bath. Kthx."
quote:
Originally posted by xaeyruudh
quote:
Originally posted by Emma Drake
In his prayers the cleric spins this request as a punishment for the failure of the ranger, not a reward for his shortcomings - cursed to wander in a form less worthy than his original drow body, he will serve penance for failures by guiding the faithful (and strong) to safety.
These are good points, and I like the spinning part. You're probably a more responsible and arguably better DM than I am, Emma. I tend to be pretty lazy when it comes to making sure that my actions/decisions are backed up by game mechanics. 
I'm actually a pretty inexperienced DM, but thanks anyway. :)
I really like it when rules and story come together and see this as a promising way for that to happen. Drow don't usually resurrect other drow because they have this philosophy of death = failure = death. But they need him. So punish him at the same time that you give him a new lease on life. It not only fixes their problem, it presents a whole set of RP opportunities. |
| xaeyruudh |
Posted - 03 Jun 2013 : 06:13:47
quote:
Originally posted by Emma Drake
In his prayers the cleric spins this request as a punishment for the failure of the ranger, not a reward for his shortcomings - cursed to wander in a form less worthy than his original drow body, he will serve penance for failures by guiding the faithful (and strong) to safety.
These are good points, and I like the spinning part. You're probably a more responsible and arguably better DM than I am, Emma. I tend to be pretty lazy when it comes to making sure that my actions/decisions are backed up by game mechanics.
My players also tend to be more knowledgeable of the rules than I am. And I've grown to cherish (one might say a bit too much) the moments when they quietly shut their books because I've gone rogue again. 
If you're going to use a mortal benefactor, then by all means be aware of what spell is being used to help the ranger... one of the other PCs might have Spellcraft and might ask you what spell is being used.
My own style is to minimize the relevance of crunchy information, and try to keep the players focused on the fluff. But that's definitely not the only way to approach it. |
| xaeyruudh |
Posted - 03 Jun 2013 : 06:00:10
I assume that your players aren't regular readers of Candlekeep? Or else you're going to modify things to the point where they're unrecognizable. 
quote:
Originally posted by MisterX
@xaeyruudh: Reincarnation! Funny idea! But still: How? I mean, I have to explain why the character re-incarnates…
I thought long about the undead-thing. This sounds to me like the possibility with the most fun in it – but the party truly hates Kiaransalee and thus all undead. On the other hand… that might be a reason for Kiaransalee to intervene… :)
Tsk tsk. The DM doesn't have to explain anything. 
You should have a reason figured out for yourself, but I wouldn't explain it to the group at all until perhaps after the adventure/campaign is over, if they ask about it. I like having a Q&A at the end of each game night, so that players can let me know if I'm confusing them in a bad way, and I can redirect questions whose answers would give too much away, but every group has its own dynamic.
I assume that the party killed the behir? But perhaps the behir was having a better night than the group was, and they had to retreat. If the behir is dead, then Rangermouse can eventually crawl/gnaw his way out and find the party. His epic and harrowing journey through the suddenly much larger and more terrifying dungeon will give him time to figure out how he's going to identify himself to the group. Or maybe he's the first talking Rangermouse in the history of the world. Ew, mental image of a mouse with a drow head.
Reincarnate brings people back as other humanoid races now? Weird. My books are all packed up for a move, so I didn't check them. I thought I remembered reincarnation meaning you came back as pretty much anything except a PC race. But I stand by "DM's Prerogative" meaning he can be transformed into any race the DM thinks is appropriate (or fun). A mouse would be extreme, and I'm sure the players would protest mightily. If the options are humanoid/PC races, I would definitely pick one that drow hate... which doesn't narrow it down much. Maybe a surface elf. Or maybe a human. Either of these options would result in an interesting psychological flipflop for the ranger... when he was a drow, he was viewed as a high threat by foes... as a surface race, he would probably suddenly be the last party member that foes would care about attacking. They would probably assume that he was a slave of the drow, and ignore him, at least for the first couple of rounds. But that's a tangent.
I think the key is to figure out (1) who is responsible for reincarnating the ranger, (2) what are the short and long-term goals he/she/it plans to achieve utilizing the party, and (3) who is the party going to be inadvertently acting against as they unwittingly do the bidding of this hidden benefactor (who of course will not reveal his/her/its identity until it's too late for the party to change the course of the events they've set in motion).
The ranger could have some idea of who the benefactor is, but it doesn't need to be an accurate idea. You mentioned that the ranger is on the Fugue Plain now... you could do some solo roleplay with that player, to set the stage for his return. Let him try to get his bearings for a little bit (I think time is a kinda empty concept there) and then suddenly something is at his elbow and then all around him... he can't see it but he can hear it, or more accurately them, whispering... secrets he's never told anyone... his losses, his moments of inadequacy, his fears both reasonable and irrational, from his earliest childhood right up to the ignominy of being eaten and excreted by a near-mindless reptile that he should have been able to defeat if he were half the ranger Drizzt was at half his age... ya know, drive the daggers deep.
The voices come from all directions, including up... because the creature is a sorrowsworn demon (MM3 pg 36, using its "past losses" ability. There's no need for a saving throw, because the demon isn't trying to daze the ranger... merely make him remember, and let his own mind soften him up for an irresistible offer: this last and biggest failure doesn't have to be permanent. He can return, with strength from beyond death, to wreak his vengeance and his victory on all who dare oppose him...
I'm guessing that the ranger will not choose to remain dead. If he does, then the player rolls up a new character and the adventure moves on in whatever direction it was heading before the arrival of the behir.
If he chooses to return, then the demon touches his forehead. For a moment, the Fugue Plain is suddenly blotted out by utter darkness... this is the bulk of the 15 ft tall demon's body and wings becoming visible in front of him, but he won't recognize a face or any features in the blackness. Then he's falling through the ground into an abyss, for an indeterminate amount of time (but he starts to become aware of time again during this fall) and then he wakes up in whatever his new form is. He doesn't really have augmented ability scores, but his mind is amped up by the demon, adrenaline is racing, and he feels unstoppable. Maybe even if he's a mouse.
Explanation/lore: the demon was hired or manipulated by the unseen power to send the ranger back into the world. MM3 says they're drawn to battlefields and the temples of dead gods... I think it's easy to infer that they would be very familiar with the Fugue Plain, which means that it wouldn't draw undue attention while stealing a soul. The demon's touch sent the ranger's soul back to his body, with a reincarnate/resurrect/animate spell (whichever you choose to use) cast by the unknown benefactor, kinda like the old spectral hand spell. And you also have the option of using the touch for some extra mystery or foreshadowing... the ranger may have a spiderveined black mark on his forehead, which can't be dispelled or changed and is visible even to darkvision. It gives the ranger no extra powers, and seems to have no negative effects... for now...
The longer the party delays in achieving the desired objectives, the worse things begin to go for the ranger. Of course, the party doesn't even know that those objectives exist.
I think I'm probably rambling now, so I'll shush.
|
| Emma Drake |
Posted - 03 Jun 2013 : 01:11:17
quote:
Originally posted by xaeyruudh
Reincarnation might be a fun alternative to resurrection.
I like this idea!
Reincarnate in 3.5 is a druid-only spell (usually). But it is 4th level and the 3.5 options are all humanoid. I think that could be quite interesting - drow hate and look down on most races. One of them is stuck in the body of a lesser being and the others have to walk around with him. It also allows for the player to get his original body back eventually, but at great cost (wish or miracle spell). Does his hatred for other races push him to dedicate his life to getting his old body back? Does he come to accept his new form? Do his companions? Good RP stuff there.
The 2e Reincarnate is a much higher level spell (7), but is a cleric spell as well. This means that while in 3.5 it's a druid-only spell, there is a tradition of clerics being able to cast it in lore. So it wouldn't be way out there for the cleric to pray for it. Maybe it's not commonly given out, but when prayed for, gods occasionally grant it. In his prayers the cleric spins this request as a punishment for the failure of the ranger, not a reward for his shortcomings - cursed to wander in a form less worthy than his original drow body, he will serve penance for failures by guiding the faithful (and strong) to safety.
That makes it difficult and come at a cost without making it too hard. |
| MisterX |
Posted - 02 Jun 2013 : 09:26:28
Thanks for your quick answers!
@idilippy: Yepp, Demons and Devils 'haunt' the Fugue Plane. I thought about this, but I don't think the ranger would sell his soul. If he did, the party (which is VERY into that Lolth-thing – they're Drow, after all!) might just outright slay him again. But I think I will make that offer anyways. :D
@Kentinel: The party wants to resurrect the ranger, because they need him. Their chance to survive decreased significantly when the ranger deceased. Like you, I don't like that 'stumbling upon' very much. It would be some kind of last resort…
@xaeyruudh: Reincarnation! Funny idea! But still: How? I mean, I have to explain why the character re-incarnates…
I thought long about the undead-thing. This sounds to me like the possibility with the most fun in it – but the party truly hates Kiaransalee and thus all undead. On the other hand… that might be a reason for Kiaransalee to intervene… :)
@Wooly Rupert: Here the minotaur-adventures might step in. I could hand-wave that their cleric can do resurrection-spells. Thought about this – liked the idea. :D |
| xaeyruudh |
Posted - 02 Jun 2013 : 08:47:42
Reincarnation might be a fun alternative to resurrection. Maybe he comes back as a mouse... quite suited to finding his way out of a maze, right? But the party will have to pay close attention to avoid stepping on him or letting him get hit during combat. Or maybe he's now an ooze, with great sensory perception and the intelligence he needs to guide them out, but incredibly slow movement. For fun, make him constantly hungry... so he knows the way out, but he leads the party on little detours into every nook and cranny (and encounter) of the dungeon, in search of lunch. Eventually, they might get out, but they'll run into every single monster in the place on the way.
Undeath is another option. Even if the rules on animate dead specify that only unintelligent undead can be created, it's your prerogative to make an exception and say the ranger hangs onto his sentience after animation... but perhaps only temporarily and neither he nor the animator know how long his awareness will last. Since he's probably unrecognizable after the behir gets "done" with him he'll be skeletal or perhaps a really messy zombie. So he stinks, and attracts more wandering monsters, and makes most diplomatic situations extra-difficult. As a zombie, he wouldn't have the motor control necessary to use the drow sign language, and he wouldn't be able to speak intelligibly as either a skeleton or zombie. He'd be stuck pantomiming and pointing. Good times! Also, an undead ranger is just fun roleplaying.
Getting pulled into a magical or nonmagical receptable/item is another possibility, especially if you combine it with Wooly's suggestion of a "benefactor" in the maze. The spell used to accomplish this effect doesn't even need to be a published spell... it's some unique thing the benefactor researched or perhaps even a natural ability of its race. You could make the benefactor something alien/weird, like a spellweaver or one of those 12 foot tall blue people from Spelljammer. And there should definitely be a hidden price to pay afterwards. From this item the ranger might have some limited sensory perceptions, or maybe he's blind and relies on the party to describe their surroundings to him in order for him to guide them out of the maze. Either way, he should be able to communicate in some way, either telepathically or maybe by changing the color of a radiance that he constantly emits (creating another headache for the party by attracting more wandering monsters, and they have one less fighter now to deal with said monsters).
Any of these can increase role-playing and also create extra challenges for the whole party. Plus, if the ranger's player is game for really getting into it, it'll be a unique opportunity to play a character that isn't normally available/viable.
Have fun with it!
Edit: I replied before reading the last part of your message. Of course you can go the Fugue Plain route if you want to, but there are other possibilities. If you do want to send them to steal the ranger's soul, I would suggest using a deity that none of them expect... an evil one, for sure, but one that's got its own agenda for them... a plan for them after they exit the dungeon... something maybe that leads into your next adventure for them, or something 2 or 3 adventures down the line after they've almost forgotten about the whole rescue operation. Only after they unwittingly perform a few deeds which help the cult of this dark god do they start to get clues that they're being used/manipulated. Perhaps ultimately they help to strengthen a cult (Ghaunadaur or Juiblex would be great) that works against drow interests. Worse, the priestesses of Lolth also find out, and now the PCs are being hunted by their allies and superiors. And "oops, I didn't know" isn't a very good excuse to give a priestess of Lolth.
Alternatively, instead of being helped by an evil god it's a high-ranking celestial who thinks it's fun to "corrupt" the servants of evil toward helping the forces of good... or at least neutral. Probably be some creature that's CN with slight leanings toward CG or NG. Something powerful and far-thinking. In this case their realization, several adventuring sessions in the future, is that they've been inadvertently helping celestials who are directly opposed to Lolth.
Either way, they're in deep dung, and this time there's nobody to help them. Or maybe they find a mysterious ally, who can shelter them until the priestesses of Lolth give up, in return for a few favors... and the fun continues. |
| Kentinal |
Posted - 02 Jun 2013 : 07:35:16
Well the party could accidentally find a raise from the death spell scroll, depending on edition rules a Cleric can use a spell scroll of higher level then normal learned spells (with a chance of failure).
There again not sure why an Evil party would want to raise a member in the first place, *shrugs* |
| Wooly Rupert |
Posted - 02 Jun 2013 : 05:02:24
How about this: the PCs aren't the only ones stuck in the maze. There is someone else stuck in there, someone who is capable of resurrecting the dead character -- but who has not left for his or her own reasons. Perhaps the benefactor is still searching for something, perhaps the benefactor is unable or unwilling to find their way out...
Mayhaps the benefactor is someone who isn't powerful enough to cast resurrection directly, but who has a scroll or magical doodad (maybe something in the maze itself, something that can't be taken out) that can do the trick. Perhaps this same benefactor is under some magical compulsion/curse/binding that's holding him or her there, and just needs someone to break it -- that's why the benefactor resurrected the dead character.
Of course, there's nothing to say this benefactor will remain friendly once free of the maze...  |
| idilippy |
Posted - 02 Jun 2013 : 04:29:30
Isn't it written somewhere that in the Fugue plane devils/demons wait around to bargain for souls of the dead who aren't ready to face their final rest? Maybe have the ranger meet up with a demon who is willing to do this, in return for favors/the ranger's soul. Of course, the ranger is a drow, just because it makes the deal doesn't mean it'll have to go through with it. Breaking free of the binding contract with an outsider can be a great opportunity for the PC in future adventures, or the favor the demon wants could make for strife and conflict.
An alternative would be to have the party "stumble upon" a magical item like a scroll of raise dead. I'm not a big fan of this but it can work. |
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