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Rils
Learned Scribe

USA
108 Posts

Posted - 08 Nov 2011 :  21:07:43  Show Profile Send Rils a Private Message  Reply with Quote  Delete Topic
THe TIme of Troubles has always intrigued me, particularly the idea that the gods were forced to walk the earth in mortal shells. I'll admit I'm not the heavily read in FR lore, but from time to time you see random comments "the avatar of so-and-so ended up in such-and-such and did this-or-that." Some were recognized as deities, some weren't. I was wondering if there was a listing somewhere of where they all ended up, and what they did until they were reinstated as deities?

Dugmaren Brightmantle is my homey.

Farrel
Learned Scribe

United Kingdom
239 Posts

Posted - 08 Nov 2011 :  21:17:55  Show Profile Send Farrel a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I always head straight to my copy of Faiths and Avatars, Demihuman Deities, and Powers & Pantheons from 2e.

Alot of the entries deal with what the God was doing during the Time of Troubles.

I think they're my favorite "go to" sourcebooks for anything to do with deities.
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Seravin
Master of Realmslore

Canada
1309 Posts

Posted - 08 Nov 2011 :  21:21:55  Show Profile Send Seravin a Private Message  Reply with Quote
What Farrel said...those books pretty much state what each God was doing and an explanation/stats of their Avatars. If there's a particular god or goddess you're interested in let us know.

I was surprised they had Labelas's Avatar and what he got up to in the demihuman deities book, even though it was only really discussed in the comic book series (which I guess is cannon too!)
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
Moderator

USA
37011 Posts

Posted - 08 Nov 2011 :  21:56:53  Show Profile Send Wooly Rupert a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Seravin

What Farrel said...those books pretty much state what each God was doing and an explanation/stats of their Avatars. If there's a particular god or goddess you're interested in let us know.

I was surprised they had Labelas's Avatar and what he got up to in the demihuman deities book, even though it was only really discussed in the comic book series (which I guess is cannon too!)



The comics are indeed canon. Most of the characters were written up in Dragon, and there are scattered mentions of them throughout Realmslore. There is a passing reference or two to the crew of the Realms Master in 3E's Shining South, and most of the characters from AD&D wound up as ranking folks in Tethyr in Lands of Intrigue. Kyriani is mentioned in Powers & Pantheons, and City of Splendors: Waterdeep names her as one of the city's Hidden Lords.

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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
Moderator

USA
37011 Posts

Posted - 08 Nov 2011 :  22:00:32  Show Profile Send Wooly Rupert a Private Message  Reply with Quote
WotC had a good list on their site of where the avatars were hanging out, but WotC has -- as usual -- moved that list somewhere else and not bothered to put a redirect in place.

I'd make a negative comment on that, but I've seen them do this so many times I just don't have the energy, at this moment.

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Ayrik
Great Reader

Canada
8091 Posts

Posted - 08 Nov 2011 :  22:06:19  Show Profile Send Ayrik a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Here are plenty of sources which list which deity was where and did what during the Avatar Crisis.

[/Ayrik]
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Rils
Learned Scribe

USA
108 Posts

Posted - 09 Nov 2011 :  00:10:39  Show Profile Send Rils a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Ayrik

Here are plenty of sources which list which deity was where and did what during the Avatar Crisis.



liiiike...?

:)

I did check my FaA, DD, etc, and you're right, some of that is in there. It seems like more are missing that info than have it listed though, the demihuman deities in particular hardly ever say anything aout the ToT. I was wondering if there were other sources, ie novels etc, that fill in the gaps.

Dugmaren Brightmantle is my homey.
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High

Australia
31799 Posts

Posted - 09 Nov 2011 :  00:54:28  Show Profile Send The Sage a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert

WotC had a good list on their site of where the avatars were hanging out, but WotC has -- as usual -- moved that list somewhere else and not bothered to put a redirect in place.

I'd make a negative comment on that, but I've seen them do this so many times I just don't have the energy, at this moment.

Here's a plain text version of most of that info, that I have on hand at the moment. The majority of the file is on my HD at home:-
quote:
Faerūnian Pantheon
The Faerūnian pantheon was the most closely involved in the Time of Troubles, with its members directly responsible for the events leading up to and ending the crisis.

Azuth: The Lord of Spells spent much of his time caring for part of Mystra's power and guarding a statue of her at the Pool of Yeven in Battledale.

Bane: Lord Bane first arrived at Zhentil Keep, but moved onwards to travel throughout the eastern Heartlands of the Realms in his quest for the Tablets of Fate.

Bhaal: Bhaal first appeared as a killing force who could possess humans in Eveningstar, Cormyr, where he began a spree of murder and destruction. He too traveled far during the Avatar Crisis.

Eldath and Mielikki: Eldath appeared with Mielikki in the North among the boughs of the Misty Forest, where together they worked to prevent their followers from great sin.

Garagos: Garagos rampaged through Westgate's harbor before wading out into the Sea of Fallen Stars, leaving a blood-red harbor in his wake.

Gond: The Wonderbringer fell to Toril as a gnome on the shores of Lantan. In gratitude for the sanctuary, he taught the Lantanese the secrets of smokepowder.

Gwaeron Windstrom and Shialla: Following his defeat at the claws of Nobanion, Malar, the Lord of Beasts, was relentlessly pursued throughout the North by Gwaeron and could not shake the Master of Tracking from his trail. Shialla allied with Gwaeron Windstrom, repairing the damage Malar's destructive rampages caused.

Helm: The Vigilant One was the only god to not lose his divine power and was charged with guarding the Celestial Stairway, a portal that leads to the otherworldly domains of the gods, from his brethren.

Hoar: Hoar stalked the Old Empires, appearing in Akanax, where he took the body of King Hippartes as his avatar. Then he appeared in Thay to obtain a cache of weapons, and he showed up in Unther, where he slew his ancient rival, Ramman, Untheric god of war.

Ibrandul: Ibrandul, god of caverns, was slain in the Underdark beneath Waterdeep by Shar in secret and his portfolio was stolen.

Iyachtu Xvim: The avatar of the godling Iyachtu Xvim, half-demon offspring of Bane, was imprisoned under Zhentil Keep.

Lliira and Waukeen: The Joybringer met with Waukeen near Shadowdale. From there the pair journeyed to the Celestial Stairway. Menaced by Helm, the two retreated to Cormanthor to plan further. There Waukeen used her divine contacts to escape to the Outer Planes, leaving what remained of her godhood in the care of Lliira. Waukeen traveled first to the Astral Plane and then the Abyss, where she was betrayed and captured by the Demon Lord Graz'zt. It would be over a decade before the Merchant's Friend was rescued from Graz'zt's Argent Palace

Loviatar: The Goddess of Pain was believed to be in Waterdeep.

Malar: Malar battled Nobanion in the Gulthmere Forest before fleeing to the North where he was hunted by Gwaeron Windstrom.

Mask: Mask spent his time secretly traveling the heartlands of Faerūn in disguise.

Mielikki: See Eldath above.

Milil: Milil journeyed to Arbalest's House in Athkatala, Amn, where he personally founded a singing circle and charged his faithful with building a new temple.

Moander: The Darkbringer's avatar was presumably in the Lost Vale of Tarkhaldale, a long-since abandoned Daleland. There he rebuilt his strength from events involving the heroes Alias and the saurial Dragonbait. Shortly after the Time of Troubles, Moander was destroyed by mortal heroes led by Finder Wyvernspur, who seized Moander's godhood.

Myrkul: Myrkul spent much of his time in Waterdeep scheming.

Mystra: Mystra's power was spread among her chosen faithful ere she was captured by Bane in Castle Kilgrave in northern Cormyr. Upon her escape, she journeyed to the Celestial Stairway where she challenged Helm.

Nobanion: In a titanic combat known as the Roar of the Shadows, Nobanion and a handful of Emerald Enclave druids drove Malar north and west from the Gulthmere Forest along the Dragon Coast. Afterwards, Lord Firemane emerged from the Gulthmere to roam the Shining Plains.

Red Knight: The Red Knight appeared in northeastern Tethyr, where she helped that nation defeat monsters raiding from the Wealdath.

Savras: Long-ago imprisoned in the Scepter of Savras by Azuth, Savras remained so during the Time of Troubles. Following that crisis, Azuth agreed to release Savras in exchange for his pledge of fealty.
S
elūne and Shar: Shar and Selūne fought another round of their age-old battle as mortals in Waterdeep. Shar also secretly slew Ibrandul beneath Waterdeep and stole his portfolio.

Shar: See Selūne above.

Sharess: Sharess took the form of the favorite concubine of the pasha of Calimport and was liberated from the growing influence of Shar by Sune.

Shaundakul: Shaundakul roamed the ruins of Myth Drannor, where he battled and destroyed the avatar of a minor orc deity.

Shiallia: See Gwaeron Windstrom above.

Siamorphe: Siamorphe manifested in the villa of a Waterdhaven lady and protected the North and Sea Wards of that great city from the large-scale damage caused by the Godswar.

Silvanus: Silvanus is reported to have been seen in the Winterwood and the Chondalwood, both of the Vilhon Reach.

Sseth: The avatar of Sseth, god of the yuan-ti serpent folk, appeared in the Black Jungles in the form of a giant, winged, magic-using snake, where he challenged his clergy to rebuild their strength. He also battled Ubtao to a draw on the eastern edge of Chult. The Mulhorandi Lord of Evil, Set, has since slain Sseth and absorbed his portfolio.

Sune: Sune rescued Sharess from the evil clutches of Shar by dousing Sharess in the sacred waters of Evergold before arriving in Teziir along the Dragon Coast.

Talona: Talona appeared to an evil human wizard named Aballister, gifted him with the recipe for the powerful Chaos Curse, and bade him to found a trifold order of wizards, priest, and warriors in the so-called mountain fort of Castle Trinity.

Talos: Talos, the Raging One, spent his time in Tsurlagol in the Vast.

Tempus: Tempus arrived in the shell of a shattered castle in Battledale before moving on to the battlefield of Swords Creek in Mistledale.

Torm: Torm discovered a great evil being done in his name in the Vast city of Tantras. There he traveled to rectify this wrong and protect that city.

Tymora: Tymora appeared at her temple in Arabel, Cormyr, and it is thought her presence there spared the city much destruction.

Ubtao: Ubtao stalked the length and breadth of Chult in the shape of a tyrannosaurus rex, where he battled to a draw with Sseth the Great Snake on the eastern edge of Chult.

Ulutiu: Ages ago, Ulutiu sank beneath the Cold Ocean causing it to freeze into the Great Glacier. There he has slept since, including throughout the Time of Troubles.

Umberlee: The ***** Queen spent the Time of Troubles in the Sea of Fallen Stars, wreaking destruction on one pirate isle after another. She also appeared in the Trackless Sea, off the coast of Trisk near the Purple Rocks, where she is believed to have met with her seraph, a mighty kraken.

Waukeen: See Lliira above.

The locations of several Faerūnian powers remain unrevealed, though some might be deduced, including Akadi, Auril, Beshaba, Chauntea, Deneir, Eshowdow (since slain), Gargauth, Grumbar, Ilmater, Istishia, Kossuth, Lathander, Leira (since slain), Lurue, Oghma, Tyr, Uthgar, and Valkur. Likewise, the demigod Jergal is mysteriously said to have played no part in the Time of Troubles. In addition, a few gods had not yet become deities, including Finder Wyvernspur and Velsharoon.
[

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Ayrik
Great Reader

Canada
8091 Posts

Posted - 09 Nov 2011 :  03:16:23  Show Profile Send Ayrik a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Lurue, I believe, was active in the forests somewhere near either Silverymoon or Baldur's Gate. At any rate, the Knights of the Unicorn (an adventuring group based in Baldur's Gate) attended Lurue during the Avatar Crisis.

I had thought either Oghma or Deneir was present in Candlekeep. A detail we must surely clarify.

[/Ayrik]
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High

Australia
31799 Posts

Posted - 09 Nov 2011 :  04:54:55  Show Profile Send The Sage a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Lurue's entry in Powers & Pantheons doesn't mention any specific locale for the appearance of her avatar during the Time of Troubles, as I recall.

As for Oghma's avatar, I've speculated in the past that he was forced to assume the form of the Grand Patriarch, and that this was partly the reason why that prominent member of Oghma's clergy suddenly disappeared during the Godswar. The Oghma-possessed Grand Patriarch then "reappeared," shortly thereafter, in a somewhat alternate guise and sequestered himself away in the depths of Candlekeep for protection. When the gods again ascended to their respective domains, the Grand Patriarch was granted the opportunity to proceed with Oghma -- as reward for his selfless service -- and eventually become the Binder's "herald" -- whereupon the Grand Patriarch, now as the devoted spirit of Oghma both into and beyond the limits of Realmspace, could seek knowledge from new worlds and/or planes.

The fate of Deneir's avatar, IIRC, remains undefined.

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Erik Scott de Bie
Forgotten Realms Author

USA
4598 Posts

Posted - 09 Nov 2011 :  15:58:00  Show Profile  Visit Erik Scott de Bie's Homepage Send Erik Scott de Bie a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I think I saw some concrete info on the demihuman deities and their actions during the ToT, but I might be mistaken. It would be neat to find again (hint hint scribes!).

I mean, I know what Erevan Ilesere was doing, but the others, too.

Cheers

Erik Scott de Bie

'Tis easier to destroy than to create.

Author of a number of Realms novels (GHOSTWALKER, DEPTHS OF MADNESS, and the SHADOWBANE series), contributor to the NEVERWINTER CAMPAIGN GUIDE and SHADOWFELL: GLOOMWROUGHT AND BEYOND, Twitch DM of the Dungeon Scrawlers, currently playing "The Westgate Irregulars"
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Seravin
Master of Realmslore

Canada
1309 Posts

Posted - 09 Nov 2011 :  16:17:23  Show Profile Send Seravin a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Labelas Enoreth fought and won a battle with the avatar of Clangeddin during the ToT, that part is in DD and in the Forgetten Realms comics. I don't remember the location tho!
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
Moderator

USA
37011 Posts

Posted - 09 Nov 2011 :  19:14:18  Show Profile Send Wooly Rupert a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Seravin

Labelas Enoreth fought and won a battle with the avatar of Clangeddin during the ToT, that part is in DD and in the Forgetten Realms comics. I don't remember the location tho!



Rauthym.

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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High

Australia
31799 Posts

Posted - 10 Nov 2011 :  01:04:05  Show Profile Send The Sage a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Erik Scott de Bie

I think I saw some concrete info on the demihuman deities and their actions during the ToT, but I might be mistaken. It would be neat to find again (hint hint scribes!).
Checking through my files at work, I find:-
quote:
Mulhorandi Pantheon
Prior to the Godswar, the ancient nation of Mulhorand was ruled by the incarnations and manifestations of their gods. The Time of Troubles changed that, sending the Mulhorandi gods back to the Outer Planes, but also bringing about a new age of activism for the pantheon. The location of most of Mulhorand's gods during this time, including Hathor, Isis, Nephthys, Osiris, Sebek, Set, and Thoth, remains unrevealed -- although most of them likely were located in that ancient empire.
Anhur: Anhur distinguished himself during the Godswar by battling the avatar of Sekolah, the great white shark deity of the sahuagin, who prowled the Alamber Sea. He also claimed the portfolio of the Untheric god of war, Ramman, from his slayer, Hoar.
Geb: Geb led an army of his most faithful followers to construct a secret temple known as the Golden Forge in the depths of the volcano on the island known as the Ship of the Gods, where they struggle to prevent the volcano from exploding to this day.
Horus-Re: Horus-re ruled Mulhorand through his manifestation in Pharaoh Horustep III in the capitol city of Skuld. The end of the Avatar Crisis removed that divinity from Horustep, leaving him only a mortal of divine lineage.
Untheric Pantheon
After millennia of misrule and tyranny under Gilgeam, what remained of the Untheric pantheon came to an end during the Godswar.
Gilgeam and Tiamat: Gilgeam, the god-king of Unther, was slain by his rival Tiamat in Unthalass, ending his two-millennium rule of that nation and spelling the end of the Untheric pantheon. Tiamat then joined the factitious Faerūnian pantheon.
Ramman: Ramman, Untheric god of war, was slain by his ancient rival Hoar, but prevented his slayer from claiming his portfolio, instead passing it on to Anhur of the Mulhorandi pantheon
Nonhuman Powers
The locations of very few nonhuman gods have been revealed. The few that have been revealed are noted below.
Clangeddin Silverbeard and Labelas Enoreth: Clangeddin Silverbeard, in the form of three dwarves melded into a giant earth elemental, battled Labelas Enoreth, who had possessed the body of his cleric Vartan Hai Sylvar for use as his avatar, over a misunderstanding upon the isle of Ruathym. The battle resulted in the destruction of Clangeddin's avatar.
Deep Duerra: Duerra's avatar appeared in Underspires, a duergar city deep below the Osraun Mountains of northern Turmish, in the form of the Queen Mother, who was serving as regent of the city until the young king reached his maturity. Under the goddess' leadership, the city's army extended the holdings of Underspires, before she disappeared into the southernmost reaches of the Underdark.
Ilsensine: The Tentacled Lord of the mind flayers manifested in the city of Oryndoll, miles beneath the Shining Plains west of the Vilhon Reach, adopting the elder brain of Oryndoll as its avatar form.
Lolth: The Spider Queen appeared in her great city of Menzoberranzan, home of the outcast Drizzt Do'Urden, where she allegedly slew a minor drow deity of assassination and usurped her portfolio.
Segojan Earthcaller and Urdlen: Hardbuckler was said to have been the site of a great struggle between the avatars and servants of the Lord of Burrows, Segojan, and the Crawler Below, Urdlen.
Sekolah: The great white shark deity of the sahuagin fought Anhur off the coast of Mulhorand in the Alamber Sea.
Selvetarm: Selvetarm rampaged through the drow city of Eryndlyn, located in hidden caves beneath the High Moor, attacking strongholds of the followers of Ghaunadaur and Vhaeraun. The avatar was eventually driven into the wild Underdark by an alliance of the victimized cults.
For Those Who HAVE Read the Avatar Trilogy
If you have read the trilogy already, you won't find any spoilers below. However, those who haven't yet read the series, please take a look at this AFTER you have finished reading the novels unless you don't mind spoilers!
Ao: Lord Ao, the Overpower, the Hidden One, was responsible for casting the gods down to Faerūn. He appeared only briefly in extradimensional places and hideaways like the Flame Void and Elminster's Safehold, before finally appearing at the end of the Avatar Crisis at Mount Waterdeep.
Bane: Bane further traveled to Castle Kilgrave, Shadowdale, Scardale, and Tantras where he was slain in battle with Torm.
Bhaal: Bhaal traveled west to High Horn, agreed to help Myrkul following Bane's death at the hands of Torm, and was slain by Cyric, who wielded the sword Godsbane (the sword was secretly the avatar of Mask) at Boareskyr Bridge, where his remains poison the waters to this day.
Cyric, Kelemvor, and Midnight: Along with Adon, a cleric of Sune, Cyric, Kelemvor, and Midnight, were the heroes (and villain) of the Avatar Crisis and traveled throughout the heartlands of the Forgotten Realms. As a reward for their acts, Cyric and Mystra were elevated to godhood by Ao. Eventually, Kelemvor, who had been slain by Cyric, was freed from Godsbane, Mask's avatar form, and himself elevated to godhood.
Mask: The Master of All Thieves disguised himself as the magical soul-stealing sword, Godsbane, the blade wielded by Cyric during the Time of Troubles and used to slay both Bhaal and Kelemvor. Mask's ploy, however, backfired in part, since Cyric stole much of his power upon attaining godhood.
Myrkul: Myrkul was destroyed atop Mount Waterdeep by Midnight, who was empowered with the essence of Mystra.
Mystra: Mystra was destroyed by Helm for challenging him on the Celestial Stairway. Her power was reborn in her servant Midnight, who took up the goddess' name and mantle.
Torm: Torm stayed true to his duty. He defended the city of Tantras from Bane and died in battle with the Black Lord. However, because he was true to his own ethos, Ao raised him back up to godhood at the end of the Avatar Crisis.

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Brin
Acolyte

17 Posts

Posted - 12 Nov 2011 :  20:46:02  Show Profile  Visit Brin's Homepage Send Brin a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Avatar series by Scott Ciencin was a series of novels not specifically covering the Avatars but it is set during the time of troubles, centered around Midnight, Kelemvor, Adon, and Cyric they run into a number of avatars. It also in the last two books actually reads from the perspective of some of the Gods, I particularly liked that.
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Thelonius
Senior Scribe

Spain
731 Posts

Posted - 14 Nov 2011 :  15:33:13  Show Profile Send Thelonius a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Is there around any info about the doings of Illmater during those times? Never been able to find any and was planning in running a campaign that somehow involved him...

"If you are to truly understand, then you will need the contrast, not adherence to a single ideal." - Kreia
"I THINK I JUST HAD ANOTHER NEAR-RINCEWIND EXPERIENCE"- Discworld's Death frustrated after Rincewind scapes his grasp... again.
"I am death, come for thee" - Nimbul, from Baldur's Gate I just before being badly spanked
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Ayrik
Great Reader

Canada
8091 Posts

Posted - 14 Nov 2011 :  20:15:15  Show Profile Send Ayrik a Private Message  Reply with Quote
There is only mention that a character named Ill Mater is often portrayed in popular plays, usually as a slapstick prop who gets pummeled about. A trend perhaps started by Volo, shortly before he went into hiding (again).

[/Ayrik]
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sleyvas
Skilled Spell Strategist

USA
12247 Posts

Posted - 15 Nov 2011 :  00:41:24  Show Profile Send sleyvas a Private Message  Reply with Quote
You know, one of the questions I always had was "What happened with the demon lords who were granting divine spells? What about their worshippers?". I actually ran one campaign where I played with this idea and actually had Ao actually cast the demon lords (specifically Orcus in that campaign, which I based in Damara) down to Toril in a lesser form. Looking back though, I like that idea less. I think it would be immensely interesting if divine magic were failing all over EXCEPT for the worshippers of demon and devil cultists. Of course, Ao might just totally cut off those demon and devil lords from granting spells temporarily too..... might not be worth his effort though, and actually might make the gods upset too, which might have made Ao happy (who can predict the actions of an overgod).

Alavairthae, may your skill prevail

Phillip aka Sleyvas
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