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Gary Dallison
Great Reader
United Kingdom
6361 Posts |
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Gary Dallison
Great Reader
United Kingdom
6361 Posts |
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Gary Dallison
Great Reader
United Kingdom
6361 Posts |
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Gary Dallison
Great Reader
United Kingdom
6361 Posts |
Posted - 27 May 2015 : 10:29:35
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Information on Anauria in the Caverns of Death article.
quote: After the fall of Netheril in the Year of the Sundered Webs, three smaller realms survived the wreckage of the great empire: Anauria, Asram, and Hlondath. Anauria was the wealthiest of these three. It stood in the broad lands north of the Stormhorns, in that part of Anauroch that is now known as the Sword. In the days of Anauria, the Stonelands were green and forested, a well-watered upland of swift streams rushing down from the mountains to the south. A number of Anaurian noble families built hunting lodges, villas, and summer palaces in the hills, retreating to the cooler elevations during the hottest months of the year. One of these families was House Nemrin, a family of wealthy nobles who wielded great influence in the affairs of Anauria.
During the last years of the kingdom, the Nemrins fell into disfavor. Accused of trafficking with demons and plotting rebellion by a rival noble family -- House Maluradek -- Lord Ashkelor Nemrin found himself banished from the court on the basis of evidence presented to the king by his rivals. Ashkelor removed himself to the relative seclusion of his family's summer palace in the hills, Nemsergaar. There Ashkelon plotted revenge against his accusers and awaited his vindication before the king.
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Alternate Realms Site |
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Gary Dallison
Great Reader
United Kingdom
6361 Posts |
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Gary Dallison
Great Reader
United Kingdom
6361 Posts |
Posted - 27 May 2015 : 10:34:01
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Mention of the Crown of the Mountain in Wyrms of the North - Valamadarace.
quote: The Crown of the Mountain: This ancient artifact appears as a crown or spike-studded circlet of rough, unadorned stone that can't be shattered by any known means. It alters to fit the brow (or wrist, or tail) of its wearer and seems immune to most spell effects (and all divinations and destructive magics thus far applied to it).
The true origin of the crown is in dispute. Some say it was a gift of the dwarven gods to their people, others that it was yet another powerful tool devised by a Netherese sorcerer-king, and there are even some who hold to the view that it was brought to Toril from some other world, suffering the loss of its primary purpose and some of its greatest powers in the process.
History
The first reliable record of the crown (as opposed to the disputed, fanciful tales of it being bestowed upon mortals by various gods, or worn by a Netherese archwizard as he went down fighting a titanic spell-battle against over forty hostile mages) occurs in three separate adventurers' diaries, all of which mention a hitherto-unknown wizard by the name of Larbrand "from southern lands" who used the crown in a quarry in the Tashalar circa 336 DR. The writers hailed from different cities around the Shining Sea; their attribution of a more southerly origin for Larbrand has led many to think he came from Halruaa or perhaps even Zakhara. The truth is now lost; even Larbrand's fate is unknown, beyond his later encounter with the sage Hoarmandar, whose description of the crown is Elminster's main source.
I'm sure i read somewhere about the Low Road about it being carved in a matter of weeks out of the solid rock which instantly made me think of this artefact. |
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Alternate Realms Site |
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Gary Dallison
Great Reader
United Kingdom
6361 Posts |
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Gary Dallison
Great Reader
United Kingdom
6361 Posts |
Posted - 27 May 2015 : 10:39:47
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Draconic enslavement mentioned in Wyrms of the North - Palandarusk.
quote:
truly ancient gold he-dragon (mature when Netheril was young), Palarandusk has prolonged his existence beyond the natural death and decay of his body through powerful magic of his own devising. Now the spells that maintain his magically-knit form are failing, and he dares materialize for only a few minutes each day -- usually showing himself for only a few seconds, to proffer something, snatch something, or attack.....
Palarandusk is first mentioned in a nameless, fragmentary book whose pages are burnished sheets of electrum stamped with characters unintelligible to the sages of today without benefits of magic to divine their meanings. In the days before Netheril was founded, Palarandusk dwelt somewhere along the Sword Coast and hunted such prey as wyverns from what is now Luskan to where Waterdeep was later founded.
Enslaved -- or forced into servitude to avoid a worse fate -- by the sorcerer Mileirigath in the early days of Netheril, Palarandusk spent centuries toiling in obedient obscurity, his longevity and eventually his nature and abilities altered by many spells cast on him by his master and Mileirigath's apprentices. When that realm of increasingly decadent splendor fell, he seized what magic (spellbooks in particular) he could from the ruins and the clutches of plundering illithids and other fell foes, and set about using his augmented magical abilities in freedom for the first time.....
Palarandusk is not known to have ever mated (though his early days are a mystery to historians and might well have included pairings), and he isn't known to particularly welcome the presence or friendship of other dragons. He worked amicably with other wyrms while in service, in Netheril, but seems never to have sought out other wyrms. A true and contented loner, the Unseen Protector maintains no current alliances.
It doesnt specifically say he was enslaved by Netheril so again i might link this to Thaeravel (legends from Elminster's Ecologies speaks of dragons enslaving humans around the Tunlands). |
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Gary Dallison
Great Reader
United Kingdom
6361 Posts |
Posted - 27 May 2015 : 10:43:19
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An first mention of Bedine i think located in Wyrms of the North - Iymrith. Also a spell used to keep phaerimm away (might explain why they used thrall armies in the later stages of netheril's fall). Finally is the possible mention of Netherese ruins in the Forgotten Forest.
quote:
Perhaps the most important of these is the magic that has kept her alive thus far: force burn, a spell derived from magic left behind by Netherese mages that is deadly to the subterranean race known as the phaerimms. Fear of it has driven them to ignore Iymrith rather than turning their power to the task of destroying her.
Adventurers are warned that Iymrith has developed spells that employ sand as a weapon -- and that apparently confer the ability to use such magic on some of the many gargoyle servants she has created. Iymrith is first heard of in adventurers' journals written circa 570 D.R. as a young and aggressive dragon who smashed a Bedine trading encampment on the edge of the desert, who tore apart a caravan bound for the distant Sword Coast, and who left the camp laden with desert gems.....
Iymrith apparently challenged an older dragon somewhere in the vicinity of the High Moor shortly after her emergence from Anauroch -- and had to flee for her life. Sorely wounded, she crashed into some ruins (possibly remnants of fallen Netheril) in the Forgotten Forest and hid for some years, healing slowly and stealing forth only by night to find food. At some point during this time of nighthunting, she somehow gained magic beyond the normal capabilities of even the oldest blue dragons; Elminster believes she was captured by a powerful archmage and modified by him to serve as an intelligent servant. This belief is supported by sightings of a blue dragon flying over the Delimbiyr Vale with a disintegrating, robed human skeleton perched between her shoulders in a high-backed saddle. This was almost certainly Iymrith, who soon began to raid camped caravans and Sword Coast settlements by night, unleashing wizard spells from a roster strong and varied enough that many mages used magic -- in vain -- to hunt down a rogue wizard they believed to be dwelling in hiding somewhere in the Greypeak Mountains.
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Alternate Realms Site |
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Gary Dallison
Great Reader
United Kingdom
6361 Posts |
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Gary Dallison
Great Reader
United Kingdom
6361 Posts |
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Gary Dallison
Great Reader
United Kingdom
6361 Posts |
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George Krashos
Master of Realmslore
Australia
6662 Posts |
Posted - 28 May 2015 : 03:17:08
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quote: Originally posted by dazzlerdal Oddly enough, from the various sources i have read, i did not really consider Hlaungadath to be a Netherese enclave (it was stated as being one in the Anauroch sourcebook, but later sources cite it as an independant human city. The fact that its spires and domes are still largely intact says to me that it is unlikely to have fallen from the sky.
Ed's original concept lore for Netheril did not specify that enclaves had to be flying citadels/cities. All archwizards of Netheril created enclaves, whether on the ground, in the sky or underground.
-- George Krashos |
"Because only we, contrary to the barbarians, never count the enemy in battle." -- Aeschylus |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36800 Posts |
Posted - 28 May 2015 : 03:49:00
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quote: Originally posted by George Krashos
quote: Originally posted by dazzlerdal Oddly enough, from the various sources i have read, i did not really consider Hlaungadath to be a Netherese enclave (it was stated as being one in the Anauroch sourcebook, but later sources cite it as an independant human city. The fact that its spires and domes are still largely intact says to me that it is unlikely to have fallen from the sky.
Ed's original concept lore for Netheril did not specify that enclaves had to be flying citadels/cities. All archwizards of Netheril created enclaves, whether on the ground, in the sky or underground.
-- George Krashos
Indeed. We had the Sargauth Enclave, as an example of underground ones, and the three that were on the seafloor in the Sea of Fallen Stars further demonstrate some geographical variations on the theme. |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen! |
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Gary Dallison
Great Reader
United Kingdom
6361 Posts |
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Gary Dallison
Great Reader
United Kingdom
6361 Posts |
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Baltas
Senior Scribe
Poland
955 Posts |
Posted - 28 May 2015 : 11:10:40
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Interesting find, especialy that some other sources claim the Rus were teleported directly to Rashemen. I actualy allways preffered this version, with the Rus wandering around, till they got to Rasehemen. Especialy that we have quite a bit of teleporting around in Realms allready. |
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Gary Dallison
Great Reader
United Kingdom
6361 Posts |
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Baltas
Senior Scribe
Poland
955 Posts |
Posted - 28 May 2015 : 11:27:44
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Good point. The Rus being pressent in the Anauroch and the Moonsea region, could also help if one ties them with Shaundakul. As I mentioned on Shaundakul's thread, they do have some connection seemingly going on. |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36800 Posts |
Posted - 28 May 2015 : 16:25:56
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quote: Originally posted by dazzlerdal
Well I get that not all enclaves are flying cities. In my rewrite I have less than a handful of city enclaves, the rest are single buildings, small towers, force objects. The ones outside the Netheril basin tend not to fly, but for those inside Netheril I have an earthgliding enclave, an atmospheric enclave (doesn't technically fly it just kinda floats), and I'm debating on a swimming enclave.
As for Hlaungadath, I think its Lost Empires of Faerun that explicitly states it is a crashed Netherese Enclave. However I believe it also states it was a one time independent settlement.
Anauroch just mentions it as a ruined city.
If it is a Netherese Enclave then why is it largely intact (with extensive cellars).
If it isn't a Netherese flying city then what is it doing all the way up by Ascore. Its location today says it was either located inside the Narrow Sea (the Bay of Ascore) or on the opposite shore. I can think of no reason for its existence on the opposite shore because the northern tundra was empty of settlements and anything of interest except the ruins of Anarath.
Also its name is strange. If it was named Hlaungadath in Netherese times then it bears a striking similarity to the oasis of Haunga, and yet both locations are infested with lamia which leads me to believe that Haunga and its derivitives are the Bedine word for lamia. Which would make Hlaungadath one of the few enclaves not called by its Netherese name.
I don't see an issue with the location. Neither the Sarguath Enclave nor the undersea ones in the Sea of Fallen Stars were inside Netheril proper.
When you've got the magic to make cities fly, a portal isn't that big of a deal and a teleport would be downright trivial.
And just because there is nothing of interest in a location now, it doesn't mean there has never been anything of interest there. Heck, the goal could have been simple isolation. |
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Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
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Edited by - Wooly Rupert on 28 May 2015 16:27:37 |
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Gary Dallison
Great Reader
United Kingdom
6361 Posts |
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Gary Dallison
Great Reader
United Kingdom
6361 Posts |
Posted - 29 May 2015 : 13:22:13
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Well i've altered a few things in the timeline to make more sense. So here is how i imagine Netheril during the First Age.
Netheril didnt suddenly become a massive super power that suddenly occupied the entire basin in a few centuries, there were large and powerful neighbours to contend with as well as substantial geographical problems.
So Netheril remains isolated in the seventon region fighting off annual raids from ogres and goblinoids from the south (they occupy the hidden valley and i needed an explanation for why Netheril didnt expand to that valley until much later). These raids are the driving force behind the formation of the Alliance of Seventon. When the Terraseer arrives in -3654 DR he manipulates the Netherese into expanding west over the Narrow Sea (the netherese couldnt do so by land because the mountains between Seventon and the Rengarth Plains were Rengarth holy ground and so anyone found trespassing was butchered on sight). So Harbourage is established first in the Teeth of Tagorlar, then Xentith (a name i made up to replace Zenith) on the south western tip of the Narrow Sea. There the netherese establish peaceful relations with the Rengarth (they arent encountering them on holy ground anymore so the Rengarth arent homicidal), and meet the elves (i dont care how magical elves are they arent going to suddenly trade with seventon when its thousands of miles away across a sea and several hostile nations). Later they meet the dwarves as well and establish Runlatha.
So i need to move around a few dates. The Netherese didnt help fight the orc horde in -3655 (they were still isolated in Seventon), instead the Rengarth killed the orcs that made it into the Netheral Basin (Rengarth later become part of Low Netheril so technically its not breaking anything).
Also the elves of Eaerlann dont begin trading magic and ideas with the Netherese in -3845, -3839 and -3830, because the netherese are thousands of miles away, across a sea and Rengarth holy land. Instead, Avrauntra is a half elf from Eaerlann who arrives in Seventon and begins educating them in the ways of magic (from Elminster's Forgotten Realms), she teaches Therion of Gers . So the Eaerlanni kind of begin trading (ideas) with the netherese and teaching them magic, but not in an overt formal way.
In -3605 DR the netherese encounter their first orc hoard (only the remnants, most of it is killed by the elves and the Rengarth), and it piques their interest in the western forest (High Forest). Seeking revenge they begin exploring the forests to the west (the orcs that were driven away by Eaerlann came out of the forest) and so in -3540 they encounter settlements of Eaerlann.
That ends the first age and in the start of the Nether age they try to "welcome" the elves into the Alliance of Seventon, but fail. Survivors of that brief war (which engenders a reluctance to go to war among the netherese - explaining why they never tried to conquer other great nations at their height of power) come across the Nether Scrolls in the ruin that is now known as the Citadel of Mists.
As for religion. During this time the Netherese worship only two deities (whose names are found in primitive cave dwellings of now long vanished ancient people) - Selune and Shar. Selune is the official patron of the Alliance of Seventon (Nether the Elder being a shaman of Selune), but Shar's worship makes gains early among the rich and powerful of Seventon because of monster raids. It is Shar's influence that brings out the warlike nature of the early Alliance and its attempts to "welcome" various people into the alliance. I'm undecided about Targus as yet whether he is known to them at the start or is born out of the various wars in Netheril's history.
Government wise during the First Age, the Alliance is a democratic union of the villages. Each village has a councillor (or elder) that gets one vote. After nether the Elder tries to take control there is a symbolic title known as "King of the Nethers" and grants the holder the power of five votes in council matters (this title is awarded to Ioulaum and lasts until the fall). The Alliance allows a seat on the council to all settlements with a population over 10,000 people. So when they welcome the gnomes into the alliance they dont get a vote and so cant vote against being enslaved. When they welcome the rengarth into the alliance the barbarians have almost no permanent settlements (Vandal Station being the exception) and so get no say on the council. Thus allowing Seventon complete control over all lands around the Narrow Sea.
And as alluded to earlier, there is no Netheril during this age, it is called the Alliance of Seventon after -3859 DR. |
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Gary Dallison
Great Reader
United Kingdom
6361 Posts |
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Arcanus
Senior Scribe
485 Posts |
Posted - 08 Jun 2015 : 20:21:08
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Arcanus eh? Lol |
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Gary Dallison
Great Reader
United Kingdom
6361 Posts |
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Gary Dallison
Great Reader
United Kingdom
6361 Posts |
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Barastir
Master of Realmslore
Brazil
1600 Posts |
Posted - 09 Jun 2015 : 16:45:07
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Canonically they didn't created svirfneblin, but spriggan, dazzlerdal. Are you expanding this? |
"Goodness is not a natural state, but must be fought for to be attained and maintained. Lead by example. Let your deeds speak your intentions. Goodness radiated from the heart."
The Paladin's Virtues, excerpt from the "Quentin's Monograph" (by Ed Greenwood) |
Edited by - Barastir on 09 Jun 2015 16:46:05 |
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Gary Dallison
Great Reader
United Kingdom
6361 Posts |
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George Krashos
Master of Realmslore
Australia
6662 Posts |
Posted - 10 Jun 2015 : 01:08:09
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Is it possible that deep gnomes weren't "created" but were simply rock gnomes who fled underground to escape a myriad of predators and after exposure to Underdark radiation evolved in time into svirfneblin?
-- George Krashos |
"Because only we, contrary to the barbarians, never count the enemy in battle." -- Aeschylus |
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31743 Posts |
Posted - 10 Jun 2015 : 02:35:44
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I'm working from a rather antiquated memory... but wasn't there an throwaway line uttered by an NPC in the deep gnome city portion of the Icewind Dale CRPG that hinted at something like this for the origin of the deep gnome community featured?
I really only remember because it was something that intrigued me, and I immediately went off searching in the lore for something that canonised that possibility. |
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"So Saith Ed" -- the collected Candlekeep replies of Ed Greenwood
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