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shades of eternity
Learned Scribe
288 Posts |
 Posted - 21 Nov 2016 : 12:39:53
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Since Volo's I've been seriously considering writing a Hobgoblin kingdom somewhere in the realms. I could easily see a Legend of the five rings type kingdom with different factions vying for control and using their xenophobia to explain why they are not found on most maps.
The big question is where?
here are a few thoughts.
- The Hordelands are the ones that might conceal one, especially if they put it near Thay.
- Also give them their own fortress around the Moonsea, I can't see Fzoul when he was alive and the chosen of bane not drafting the Hobgoblins into his nefarious schemes. Even after his ascention, I could see the hobgoblins taking care of the power vaccuum.
- Vaasa is also a great place to setup the kingdom: Zhengyi the Witch-King has been dead for centuries and hobgoblins are the most likely race to fill in the power vaccuum.
- Also seriously considering making a city -state somewhere along the edges of anauroch which is why one of the reasons why cormyr has so many problems pacifying the stonelands (and also gives my stonelander minotaurs somebody to feud with).
Also any empty space in the Underdark to put such a settlement?
and just to give a taste.
http://breadthofpopsanity.blogspot.ca/2015/07/dungeons-and-dragons-about-hobgoblins.html
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check out my post-post apocalyptic world at www.drevrpg.com |
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BadCatMan
Senior Scribe
Australia
401 Posts |
Posted - 21 Nov 2016 : 13:01:52
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There's the Kingdom of Nix:
http://forgottenrealms.wikia.com/wiki/Kingdom_of_Nix
It's rather distant, being in the Utter East, and it's not exactly canon (coming only from the Blood & Magic game), but it's easy to give it more of an eastern flavour and develop it further. The game says "goblin" but the units in game look more like orcs and could easily be hobgoblins.
The Blood of Morueme is a mixed society of blue dragons, draconic hobgoblins, and half-dragons, dwelling in the North. They're organised and powerful that they could be developed into a kingdom, especially depending on when you're playing.
http://forgottenrealms.wikia.com/wiki/Blood_of_Morueme |
BadCatMan, B.Sc. (Hons), M.Sc.
Scientific technical editor
Head DM of the Realms of Adventure play-by-post community
Administrator of the Forgotten Realms Wiki |
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Markustay
Realms Explorer extraordinaire
USA
15724 Posts |
Posted - 21 Nov 2016 : 15:06:56
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The Shaar, and Chult are two more good options. Maybe even the Great Glacier (Icegoblins?)
The further you get from 'The Heartlands', the more options you have. Plenty of empty islands as well.
Gwarch (in the Stonelands) is a 'goblin trading post'. The Teerac tribe have become a 'neutral zone' for various factions, and I envision them having 'secret leaders' no-one ever really sees. My idea was that they were lead by Blues, and had a decent contingent of Hobgoblins working under them (literally - they have a connection to the Underdark).
Gwarch an be seen on the canon 4e Cormyr map (even though it was originally MY homebrew). |
"I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me" --- Dudley Field Malone
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Edited by - Markustay on 21 Nov 2016 15:11:20 |
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shades of eternity
Learned Scribe
288 Posts |
Posted - 22 Nov 2016 : 04:24:41
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man Chult is tempting
the Batiri are jungle goblins, but I could see the Hobgoblin equivalent being more Zulu like.
But what I'm thinking is a portable war camp that can be plug and play depending where it is needed.
I really like the idea of a portable city, but would have to figure out a way to make it so it can appear just about any where as needed, while avoiding the standard "wizard did it." I could see the hobgoblin engineering corps can have a city pop up overnight and tear one down the next.
Also how do you have factions within the city that just don't break off and go their separate ways?
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check out my post-post apocalyptic world at www.drevrpg.com |
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AuldDragon
Senior Scribe
USA
550 Posts |
Posted - 22 Nov 2016 : 07:39:08
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There was a hobgoblin realm in Tethyr, around the Gorge of the Fallen Idol, but it was destroyed by Calimshan. The date of that kingdom was circa -3500 DR. Details are in Lands of Intrigue.
In the 1370s there's a hobgoblin kingdom in the remnants of one of the subkingdoms of Deep Shanatar, called Holorarar. They've been there for 1500 years. Details are in Drizzt Do'Urden's Guide to the Underdark.
Those are the only canonical hobgoblin realms that I'm aware of in the Realms, at least in the AD&D era.
Jeff |
My 2nd Edition blog: http://blog.aulddragon.com/
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"That sums it up in a nutshell, AuldDragon. You make a more convincing argument. But he's right and you're not." |
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Giant Snake
Seeker
57 Posts |
Posted - 10 Apr 2024 : 19:28:01
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| They’re supposed to be very organized so it always is a mystery to me why they never really establish any sort of states of their own. Usually they wind up being lackeys to a greater evil and that’s that. |
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Delnyn
Senior Scribe
USA
890 Posts |
Posted - 10 Apr 2024 : 22:10:20
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quote:
Originally posted by Giant Snake
They’re supposed to be very organized so it always is a mystery to me why they never really establish any sort of states of their own. Usually they wind up being lackeys to a greater evil and that’s that.
I guess hobgoblins never developed a strong magical tradition, whether arcane or divine. (Weaboo Fightan Magick does not count.) Nor have hobgoblins developed a strong psionic tradition. |
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Giant Snake
Seeker
57 Posts |
Posted - 11 Apr 2024 : 02:31:20
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That makes sense. I like the idea of them actually having to rely on regular goobs as casters of any sort.
Of the books I have read they usually are not really even a step above goblins in regards to the threat they pose. |
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Werthead
Learned Scribe
United Kingdom
175 Posts |
Posted - 11 Apr 2024 : 21:21:56
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There are strong hobgoblin tribal groupings in the Giantspire Mountains on the border between Damara, Impiltur and Narfell (particularly the Razorheart tribe under Queen Maaqua), and also in the Stonelands on the northern border of Cormyr.
Hobgoblin tribes from the Small Teeth played a key role in the army of Sythillis and Cyrvisnea when they besieged and took Murann, and in the subsequent Sythillisian/Sothillisian Empire.
I don't think hobgoblins are part of the Kingdom of Nix up in the Yehimal; I believe the confusion is because the (terrible) Blood & Magic video game uses a hobgoblin reference image for standard goblins, from a development mistake.
Hobgoblins are an odd one in that they rarely show up by themselves, they're usually part of a wider coalition including goblins, orcs, bugbears and sometimes ogres. My sense was that they were not numerous enough to support large kingdoms or groups themselves and had to collaborate with others. |
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Giant Snake
Seeker
57 Posts |
Posted - 12 Apr 2024 : 02:11:18
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I imagine the philosophy of the Czar’s army - “kill one, train two” - isn’t quite so effective when you’re just a minority among goblinoids and even then a minority amongst monsters in general.
From games and books the Hobgoblins typically are portrayed as fodder or mindless lackeys. It’s sort of unfortunate because the actual lore behind them is really good, being the anti-orcs in a way. Also it may simply be the that not being so chaotic as orcs means they are more predictable despite their best efforts, so rangers and other defenders have an easier time culling them. |
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TomCosta
Forgotten Realms Designer
USA
954 Posts |
Posted - 12 Apr 2024 : 18:28:09
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| There is a hobgoblin kingdom north of Kara Tur (see 4E Hengeyokai article in Dragon). That said, I always liked the idea of one being in the Tortured Lands to the east of Aunauroch in the far north. |
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Galuf the Dwarf
Senior Scribe
USA
503 Posts |
Posted - 21 Apr 2024 : 01:45:00
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| The Earthfast Mountains in the North are known to have a significant number of goblinoid inhabitants, including Hobgoblins. You could have them found a kingdom there, I'd wager. |
Galuf's Baldur's Gate NPC stats: forum.candlekeep.com/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=8823
Galuf's 3.5 Ed. Cleric Domains: forum.candlekeep.com/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=14036
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Galuf's Forgotten Realms Heralds and Allies thread: forum.candlekeep.com/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=8766 |
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George Krashos
Master of Realmslore
Australia
6646 Posts |
Posted - 21 Apr 2024 : 03:41:43
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quote:
Originally posted by Galuf the Dwarf
The Earthfast Mountains in the North are known to have a significant number of goblinoid inhabitants, including Hobgoblins. You could have them found a kingdom there, I'd wager.
Giantspire Mountains, not Earthfast Mountains.
-- George Krashos |
"Because only we, contrary to the barbarians, never count the enemy in battle." -- Aeschylus |
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Galuf the Dwarf
Senior Scribe
USA
503 Posts |
Posted - 21 Apr 2024 : 04:21:14
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quote:
Originally posted by George Krashos
quote:
Originally posted by Galuf the Dwarf
The Earthfast Mountains in the North are known to have a significant number of goblinoid inhabitants, including Hobgoblins. You could have them found a kingdom there, I'd wager.
Giantspire Mountains, not Earthfast Mountains.
-- George Krashos
https://forgottenrealms.fandom.com/wiki/Earthfast_Mountains
That mentions there being quite a few Hobgoblins.
Also Player's Guide to Faerun has the Earthfast Mountains mentioned as a potential starting region for Goblinoid races on pg 30. |
Galuf's Baldur's Gate NPC stats: forum.candlekeep.com/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=8823
Galuf's 3.5 Ed. Cleric Domains: forum.candlekeep.com/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=14036
Galuf's Homebrew 4th Edition Races: forum.candlekeep.com/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=13787
Galuf's Homebrew Specialty Priest PrCs: forum.candlekeep.com/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=14353
Galuf's Forgotten Realms Heralds and Allies thread: forum.candlekeep.com/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=8766 |
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Werthead
Learned Scribe
United Kingdom
175 Posts |
Posted - 21 Apr 2024 : 14:28:46
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Earthfast is also home to one of the largest and most powerful dwarven kingdoms in northern Faerun, whom I suspect would have little truck with large numbers of hobgoblins on their doorstep.
Individual wandering hobgoblins or even isolated and highly mobile warbands sure, but no large kingdom. |
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Galuf the Dwarf
Senior Scribe
USA
503 Posts |
Posted - 21 Apr 2024 : 17:50:58
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quote:
Originally posted by Werthead
Earthfast is also home to one of the largest and most powerful dwarven kingdoms in northern Faerun, whom I suspect would have little truck with large numbers of hobgoblins on their doorstep.
Individual wandering hobgoblins or even isolated and highly mobile warbands sure, but no large kingdom.
Still, a rising kingdom of Hobgoblins (and Goblinoids in general) to rival them would be an interesting story arc, wouldn't you think? |
Galuf's Baldur's Gate NPC stats: forum.candlekeep.com/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=8823
Galuf's 3.5 Ed. Cleric Domains: forum.candlekeep.com/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=14036
Galuf's Homebrew 4th Edition Races: forum.candlekeep.com/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=13787
Galuf's Homebrew Specialty Priest PrCs: forum.candlekeep.com/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=14353
Galuf's Forgotten Realms Heralds and Allies thread: forum.candlekeep.com/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=8766 |
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Werthead
Learned Scribe
United Kingdom
175 Posts |
Posted - 21 Apr 2024 : 19:23:49
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| They tried that in 1095 DR, when a hobgoblin force arose in the Earthfast Mountains and invaded Impiltur at the head of an army of lesser goblinoids. Impiltur allied with the dwarves of Earthfast and the wood elves of the Gray Forest to destroy them in battle. Obviously a while back, so another force could have arisen in the meantime. |
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Galuf the Dwarf
Senior Scribe
USA
503 Posts |
Posted - 22 Apr 2024 : 02:51:29
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quote:
Originally posted by Werthead
They tried that in 1095 DR, when a hobgoblin force arose in the Earthfast Mountains and invaded Impiltur at the head of an army of lesser goblinoids. Impiltur allied with the dwarves of Earthfast and the wood elves of the Gray Forest to destroy them in battle. Obviously a while back, so another force could have arisen in the meantime.
Of course. I mean, look at what happened with King Obould Many-Arrows. He lost his original kingdom (Citadel of Many Arrows) to its rightful (previous) owner (King Emerus Warcrown) only to found a whole new kingdom for his people (The Kingdom of Many-Arrows). Nothing could rule out (at least in a DM's personal campaign) the Hobgoblins rising again.
In this case, I'm questioning if a unique and powerful Hobgoblin leader would arise, namely one who is a Half-Fiend (likely being half Devil) or Half-Dragon (I'm guessing Green or Blue Dragon heritage). Of course, he's got other powerful goblinoid cohorts backing him and maybe some other monsters or evil humanoids (namely Drow from either Menzoberranzan, Ches Nasad or Bregan Daerthe) manipulating events as "benefactors." |
Galuf's Baldur's Gate NPC stats: forum.candlekeep.com/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=8823
Galuf's 3.5 Ed. Cleric Domains: forum.candlekeep.com/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=14036
Galuf's Homebrew 4th Edition Races: forum.candlekeep.com/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=13787
Galuf's Homebrew Specialty Priest PrCs: forum.candlekeep.com/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=14353
Galuf's Forgotten Realms Heralds and Allies thread: forum.candlekeep.com/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=8766 |
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George Krashos
Master of Realmslore
Australia
6646 Posts |
Posted - 22 Apr 2024 : 11:50:45
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The Earthfasts have orcs. As per FR11.
-- George Krashos |
"Because only we, contrary to the barbarians, never count the enemy in battle." -- Aeschylus |
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Giant Snake
Seeker
57 Posts |
Posted - 26 Apr 2024 : 04:34:02
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| Hobgoblins aren’t easy to really tie down with what their motivations are. Maybe like a really heavily hazed military unit - those don’t function very well. I also think maybe some of them are more outstanding than others and those would be the ones you might encounter randomly because they are out testing their strength or maybe just hunting dangerous game. |
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Hobgoblin Kingdoms?
