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Dargoth
Great Reader
Australia
4607 Posts |
 Posted - 26 Apr 2004 : 07:37:57
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quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
quote:
Originally posted by Dargoth
Yeah I knew of those
I was hoping to find out if there where more Deep Gnome cities than the 2 we already know of
Have you checked Drizzt Do'Urden's Guide to the Underdark?
hmm I just had a look
The Deep Gnome write up at the start of DGTU says that most Deep Gnome cities are around the Buried Realm (not inside it though) but there dont appear to be any cities around there that havent been assigned to another race |
“I am the King of Rome, and above grammar”
Emperor Sigismund
"Its good to be the King!"
Mel Brooks |
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Dargoth
Great Reader
Australia
4607 Posts |
Posted - 26 Apr 2004 : 10:06:09
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Hmm just checked out Credits for DGTU and Half the memebers of this board are credited
Ed Greenwood
Steven Schend
Eric Boyd
George Krashos
ok so its not Half!
but there should be some good Deep Gnome info out there  |
“I am the King of Rome, and above grammar”
Emperor Sigismund
"Its good to be the King!"
Mel Brooks |
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Lady Kazandra
Senior Scribe
Australia
921 Posts |
Posted - 26 Apr 2004 : 10:09:58
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That's strange.
George has visited this thread, but hasn't said that much about other Deep Gnome cities.
Perhaps we need to rattle his cage a little more  .
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"Once upon a time the plural of 'wizard' was 'war'." -- The Last Continent, by Terry Pratchett |
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Dargoth
Great Reader
Australia
4607 Posts |
Posted - 26 Apr 2004 : 10:15:11
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quote:
Originally posted by Lady Kazandra
That's strange.
George has visited this thread, but hasn't said that much about other Deep Gnome cities.
Perhaps we need to rattle his cage a little more .
Damn he has to!
George spread the info! |
“I am the King of Rome, and above grammar”
Emperor Sigismund
"Its good to be the King!"
Mel Brooks |
Edited by - Dargoth on 26 Apr 2004 10:15:45 |
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Lady Kazandra
Senior Scribe
Australia
921 Posts |
Posted - 26 Apr 2004 : 10:23:49
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I know that you eventually free the deep gnomes of Dorn's Deep, but was there any repopulation of Dorn's Deep by the svirfneblin in IWD 2?.
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"Once upon a time the plural of 'wizard' was 'war'." -- The Last Continent, by Terry Pratchett |
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Dargoth
Great Reader
Australia
4607 Posts |
Posted - 26 Apr 2004 : 10:32:03
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| its been ages since I played IWD2 |
“I am the King of Rome, and above grammar”
Emperor Sigismund
"Its good to be the King!"
Mel Brooks |
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Lady Kazandra
Senior Scribe
Australia
921 Posts |
Posted - 26 Apr 2004 : 10:39:09
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Well then, reinstall the game and play through it, so you can find out . . .
I'm kidding of course. Maybe there's some material, or a walkthrough available online that can tell me.
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"Once upon a time the plural of 'wizard' was 'war'." -- The Last Continent, by Terry Pratchett |
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George Krashos
Master of Realmslore
Australia
6688 Posts |
Posted - 26 Apr 2004 : 13:26:01
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Would you believe there aren't any?
Okay, didn't think so. And neither do I.
Let's face it all. Gnomes and Deep Gnomes have been severly neglected by the powers that be. Similarly, it's difficult for us "unofficial" designers/creators to do much with a subject that has no support from an official perspective when more juicy targets (such as Cormyr, Impiltur, and the North to name my fave areas) present themselves.
I could think up some gnome and deep gnome material. But let's look (to use a cricket metaphor) at the runs on the board. Blingdenstone and the Bloodstone cities have been identified. Faraer quite rightly pointed out the material in Ed's Dragon article. That is it ... and then of course after Eric does a fabulous job of fleshing out Bligdenstone in DDGttU, FR 3E goes on to obliterate the place. I'm still trying to work out why ... 
Basically, unless Ed has something up his sleeve (and doesn't he always) the gnomes are very much the Forgotten Folk. Look at the "wonderful" treatment they got in Races of Faerun. If you are an dwarf PC you can say that your character has his/her origins in Delzoun, Shanatar, Besilmer, Gharraghaur; the list goes on. If you have a gnome PC, about the best you can do for background is to say he/she is from "that hill over there". But then again, think of all the great feats and prestige classes you can use.
Seriously, gnomes and their deep cousins are the gaping hole in the FR firmament. Halflings have received some assistance from 3E but the gnomes haven't received much of a boost, if at all. Question is, will anything ever be done about it? Your guess is as good as mine.
I think there is at least one further reference to a svirfneblin city - in Ed's Polyhedron articles. I'll have a dig and get back to you.
-- George Krashos
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"Because only we, contrary to the barbarians, never count the enemy in battle." -- Aeschylus |
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Lady Kazandra
Senior Scribe
Australia
921 Posts |
Posted - 26 Apr 2004 : 13:30:42
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Well, there has to be a reason why they are considered the 'Forgotten Folk' of the Realms doesn't there . . . .
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"Once upon a time the plural of 'wizard' was 'war'." -- The Last Continent, by Terry Pratchett |
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Dargoth
Great Reader
Australia
4607 Posts |
Posted - 26 Apr 2004 : 13:56:23
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hmmm
Hey George as you worked on DGTU can you tell us what Races occupy the undetailed cities on the DGTU map?
There are quite a few cities that simply arent mentioned at all but are on the map |
“I am the King of Rome, and above grammar”
Emperor Sigismund
"Its good to be the King!"
Mel Brooks |
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George Krashos
Master of Realmslore
Australia
6688 Posts |
Posted - 27 Apr 2004 : 05:24:16
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Well, Eric's the man to ping about this but I'll give you what I recall:
Jhachalkhyn: drow
Buiyrandyn: drow
Eryndlyn: drow
Tsenviilyq: derro
Kanaglym: dwarves (maybe duergar now)
Karsoluthiyl: drow
Tellectus: formerly illithid
Sschindylryn: drow
Vault of the Star Ruby: svirfnebli
I'll have to search through my DDGttU notes for more. I'll get back to you.
-- George Krashos
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"Because only we, contrary to the barbarians, never count the enemy in battle." -- Aeschylus |
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Lady Kazandra
Senior Scribe
Australia
921 Posts |
Posted - 27 Apr 2004 : 06:12:27
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Wow . . . thanks George . While I had a rough idea as to the racial inhabitants for most of the cities you've mentioned, I had no idea the Vault of the Star Ruby was a Deep Gnome habitat. This is interesting.
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"Once upon a time the plural of 'wizard' was 'war'." -- The Last Continent, by Terry Pratchett |
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Dargoth
Great Reader
Australia
4607 Posts |
Posted - 27 Apr 2004 : 06:39:06
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quote:
Originally posted by George Krashos
Well, Eric's the man to ping about this but I'll give you what I recall:
Jhachalkhyn: drow
Buiyrandyn: drow
Eryndlyn: drow
Tsenviilyq: derro
Kanaglym: dwarves (maybe duergar now)
Karsoluthiyl: drow
Tellectus: formerly illithid
Sschindylryn: drow
Vault of the Star Ruby: svirfnebli
I'll have to search through my DDGttU notes for more. I'll get back to you.
-- George Krashos
Unfortunately I dont know the Summon Eric spell
Much appreciated (more info the better)
I am happy to see that there is another Deep Gnome city |
“I am the King of Rome, and above grammar”
Emperor Sigismund
"Its good to be the King!"
Mel Brooks |
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ericlboyd
Forgotten Realms Designer
USA
2089 Posts |
Posted - 27 Apr 2004 : 13:51:28
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I think George got right the ones he listed (although I'm blanking on Tellectus), but I don't have the map handy (at work) to refresh my memory.
If someone wants to post the city names (and rough location) they're curious about, I can probably post a reply from memory. Otherwise, it'll be tonight.
--Eric |
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http://www.ericlboyd.com/dnd/ |
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ericlboyd
Forgotten Realms Designer
USA
2089 Posts |
Posted - 27 Apr 2004 : 13:55:12
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Just thought of two more ...
Llacerellyn (illithids, Middle Underdark)
M__ (drow, located under the Shining Sea, see rumors/recent events section of Menzoberranzan boxed set)
--Eric |
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http://www.ericlboyd.com/dnd/ |
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ericlboyd
Forgotten Realms Designer
USA
2089 Posts |
Posted - 27 Apr 2004 : 13:58:54
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FWIW, the Vault of the Star Ruby is written up in Demihuman Deities, in the write-up of Calladuran Smoothands.
--Eric |
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http://www.ericlboyd.com/dnd/ |
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Lady Kazandra
Senior Scribe
Australia
921 Posts |
Posted - 27 Apr 2004 : 13:59:10
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I have a question - Was it simply a coincidence that the Illithid community of Tellectus resemble - in whatever way - the noun 'intellect'?. I mean, I know the Mind Flayers are rather cerebral creatures, but it's just something that has been playing on my mind (sorry, no pun intended ) since I read through George's list.
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"Once upon a time the plural of 'wizard' was 'war'." -- The Last Continent, by Terry Pratchett |
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ericlboyd
Forgotten Realms Designer
USA
2089 Posts |
Posted - 27 Apr 2004 : 14:02:04
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Is it just a coincidence that "intellect" and "delectable" are so close in sound and form?
Inquiring illithids need to know.
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http://www.ericlboyd.com/dnd/ |
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Lady Kazandra
Senior Scribe
Australia
921 Posts |
Posted - 27 Apr 2004 : 14:07:55
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I guess I should have expected that .
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"Once upon a time the plural of 'wizard' was 'war'." -- The Last Continent, by Terry Pratchett |
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Dargoth
Great Reader
Australia
4607 Posts |
Posted - 27 Apr 2004 : 14:34:09
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quote:
Originally posted by ericlboyd
I think George got right the ones he listed (although I'm blanking on Tellectus), but I don't have the map handy (at work) to refresh my memory.
If someone wants to post the city names (and rough location) they're curious about, I can probably post a reply from memory. Otherwise, it'll be tonight.
--Eric
Dusklyngh
Ulin'Tharnor
Glanderltok
Those 3 are north of the Moonsea and East of the Buried Realms
Zanhorloch which is East of Ashbenford
Phulglotllaret which is under Seambia
Grunthorigard and Nar'Vheen which are near Calaunt |
“I am the King of Rome, and above grammar”
Emperor Sigismund
"Its good to be the King!"
Mel Brooks |
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Dargoth
Great Reader
Australia
4607 Posts |
Posted - 27 Apr 2004 : 14:50:47
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quote:
Originally posted by ericlboyd
Just thought of two more ...
Llacerellyn (illithids, Middle Underdark)
M__ (drow, located under the Shining Sea, see rumors/recent events section of Menzoberranzan boxed set)
--Eric
Thanks Eric |
“I am the King of Rome, and above grammar”
Emperor Sigismund
"Its good to be the King!"
Mel Brooks |
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Dargoth
Great Reader
Australia
4607 Posts |
Posted - 27 Apr 2004 : 15:15:17
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Ok Ive taken all the locations off the DGTU map and then gone through DGTU and its predacessor Underdark and combined all the info into an Excel spread sheet
Unfortuantely Excel format doesnt meld well with the boards code so this may come out looking a little weird
Name of Underdark site Race living there Source
Acid Aerie...... Formerly Corbies DGTU
Aixlintar....... Beholders/Phaerimm DGTU
Azerkyn Clanhold
Barakuir........ Duergar......... UD\DGTU
Blingdenstone... Deep gnome...... UD
Brightaxe hall
Buiyrandyn...... Formerly Drow/Now Hook Horrors DGTU
Cave of the Colossus
Cavern of Cloven heads Grimlocks....... DGTU
Chaulssin....... Drow/Abandoneoned UD/DGTU
Ched Nasad...... Drow/Destroyed.. UD
Chi'Chitl....... Mind Flayer..... UD/DGTU
Dead Dragon Gorge Cave fishers and Dragazhar DGTU
Dolblunde....... Formerly Rock Gnomes\Now lair of Daurgothoth UD/DGTU
Drakkalor....... Formerly Dwarf\now Skulk UD/DGTU
Drygulley Tunnel
Dusklyngh
Entemoch Boon... Uninhabited (Deep Gnome) DGTU
Eryndlyn........ Drow............ UD/DGTU
Evenfire........ Dwarves......... DGTU/SM
Febdlesticks Folly Former Human Wizard DGTU
Gargolye Tube... Demons?......... DGTU
Gauntlgrym
Ginsunlix....... Beholders/Phaerimm DGTU
Glanderultok
Gracklstugh..... Duergar......... UD/DGTU
Grunthorigard
Guallidurth...... Drow UD/DGTU
Holorar......... Formerly Dwarf\Now hobgoblin UD/DGTU
Iltkazar........ Shield Dwarf.... UD/DGTU
Iritaskar
Jhachalkhyn
Kanaglym
Karsoluthiyl.... Drow............ DGTU
Korolnor........ Derro/Troll..... UD/DGTU
Llacerellyn
Maeralyn
Maerimydra Formerly Drow\Now undead UD\COSQ
Malydren/Rringlor noroth Ixzan/Cloaker DGTU/UD
Mantol-Derith Deep Gnome/Drow/Duegar/ Surface Dwellers UD/DGTU
Menzoberranzan.. Drow............ UD/DGTU
Mines of Mirabar
Mines of Tethyamar Various......... UD/DGTU
Morndivver
Nar'Vheen
New Caverns..... Mold............ DGTU
Oasis of the Stone king Formerly Myconoids\Now Sinisters DGTU
Oldonnar........ Urdunnirin...... DGTU
Ooltul.......... Beholders/Phaerimm UD/DGTU
Oryndoll........ Mind Flayers.... UD/DGTU
Phanlinksal..... Formerly Mindflayers\Now Neothelid DGTU
Phuglotllaret
Qintaroth....... Beholders/Phaerimm DGTU
Ruins of Oghrann Formerly Shield Dwarfs/Now Gauths DGTU
Ruins of Tellectus Formerly MindFlayers DGTU
Sabrishon
Sloopdilmonpolp. Kuo-Toa......... UD/DGTU
Soubar
Sschindylrn's gate Portal to an Unknown plane DGTU
Sschindylryn
Sshamath........ Drow............ UD/DGTU
Stoneshaft Clan. Dwarves......... DGTU
Thaalud Tunnels
The Great worm Cavern
The Lustrum
Therlarns fist
Torglor......... Githyanki....... UD/DGTU
Trollspear Clanhold
Tsenviilyq
Uestingpool
Ullin'Tharnor
Ultoksamrin..... Formerly Shield Dwarf\ Now Drow followers of Vhaerun UD/DGTU
Ultoksurllur
Vault of the Star ruby
Viksanmaq....... Beholders/Phaerimm DGTU
Xothaerin....... Formerly Shield Dwarf/Now Stingers and Formorians UD/DGTU
Xunqaq.......... Beholders/Phaerimm DGTU
Zanhoriloch
Zokir Beholders DGTU
Zz' Pzora's lair Formerly Deep Dragon DGTU |
“I am the King of Rome, and above grammar”
Emperor Sigismund
"Its good to be the King!"
Mel Brooks |
Edited by - Alaundo on 27 Apr 2004 16:26:19 |
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Lady Kazandra
Senior Scribe
Australia
921 Posts |
Posted - 27 Apr 2004 : 16:16:50
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This is great Dargoth  .
Perhaps you should ask Alaundo to make this information available on the main site. It's a useful DM resource.
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"Once upon a time the plural of 'wizard' was 'war'." -- The Last Continent, by Terry Pratchett |
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Alaundo
Head Moderator
United Kingdom
5699 Posts |
Posted - 27 Apr 2004 : 16:24:36
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quote:
Originally posted by Lady Kazandra
This is great Dargoth .
Perhaps you should ask Alaundo to make this information available on the main site. It's a useful DM resource.
Well met
Indeed This is a great collection of lore that certainly deserves a place within the library. The original document would be greatly appreciated, Dargoth  |
Alaundo
Candlekeep Forums Head Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
An Introduction to Candlekeep - by Ed Greenwood
The Candlekeep Compendium - Tomes of Realmslore penned by Scribes of Candlekeep
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Sarta
Senior Scribe
USA
505 Posts |
Posted - 28 Apr 2004 : 01:45:24
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...and everyone's assignment is to choose three that have no entries and track down the missing info.
Sarta |
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ericlboyd
Forgotten Realms Designer
USA
2089 Posts |
Posted - 28 Apr 2004 : 01:52:19
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I filled out what I could from memory ...
--Eric
Name of Underdark site Race living there Source
Acid Aerie...... Formerly Corbies DGTU/Exile
Aixlintar....... Beholders/Phaerimm DGTU
Azerkyn Clanhold Formerly salamanders/now stingers DGTU, MoF
Barakuir........ Duergar......... UD\DGTU
Blingdenstone... Deep gnome...... UD
Brightaxe hall Formerly shield dwarves, now abandoned? DGTU
Buiyrandyn...... Formerly Drow/Now Hook Horrors DGTU
Cave of the Colossus ???
Cavern of Cloven heads Grimlocks....... DGTU
Chaulssin....... Drow/Abandoneoned UD/DGTU
Ched Nasad...... Drow/Destroyed.. DGTU / UD
Chi'Chitl....... Mind Flayer..... DGTU/C&D/UD
Dead Dragon Gorge Cave fishers and Dragazhar ... Daughter of the Drow / DGTU
Dolblunde....... Formerly Rock Gnomes\Now lair of Daurgothoth Dragon #__ (Dauragoth [sp?]) / DGTU/UD
Drakkalor....... Formerly Dwarf\now Skulk UD/DGTU
Drygulley Tunnel Daughter of the Drow / DGTU
Dusklyngh Drow ... Menzo
Entemoch Boon... Uninhabited (Deep Gnome) Exile / DGTU
Eryndlyn........ Drow............ Menzo / Demihuman Deities / DGTU / UD
Evenfire........ Dwarves......... DGTU/SM
Febdlesticks Folly Former Human Wizard Exile / DGTU
Gargolye Tube... Demons?......... DGTU / Dungeon of Death
Gauntlgrym Formerly humans / now various monsters including illithids, werewolves FR5 / The North / FRCS / Silver Marches
Ginsunlix....... Beholders/Phaerimm DGTU
Glanderultok ... ???
Gracklstugh..... Duergar......... UD/DGTU
Grunthorigard ... Duergar ... various RPGA LC materials
Guallidurth...... Drow UD/DGTU
Holorar......... Formerly Dwarf\Now hobgoblin UD/DGTU
Iltkazar........ Shield Dwarf.... UD/DGTU
Iritaskar ..... ???
Jhachalkhyn ... drow ... Menzo
Kanaglym ...... formerly dwarves / now abandoned ... Waterdeep, The Forgotten Realms Atlas (KWF)
Karsoluthiyl.... Drow............ DGTU
Korolnor........ Derro/Troll..... UD/DGTU
Llacerellyn .... illithids ... EE:THM / SK
Maeralyn ....... drow ... Menzo
Maerimydra Formerly Drow\Now undead UD\COSQ
Malydren/Rringlor noroth Ixzan/Cloaker DGTU/UD
Mantol-Derith Deep Gnome/Drow/Duegar/ Surface Dwellers UD/DGTU
Menzoberranzan.. Drow............ UD/DGTU
Mines of Mirabar Formerly shield dwarves / now fiends & humanoids ... FR11 Dwarves Deep
Mines of Tethyamar Various......... UD/DGTU
Morndivver ..... ???
Nar'Vheen .... ??? (probably drow)
New Caverns..... Mold............ Menzo / DGTU
Oasis of the Stone king Formerly Myconoids\Now Sinisters Exile DGTU
Oldonnar........ Urdunnirin...... DGTU
Ooltul.......... Beholders/Phaerimm UD/DGTU
Oryndoll........ Mind Flayers.... UD/DGTU
Phanlinksal..... Formerly Mindflayers\Now Neothelid DGTU
Phuglotllaret ... kuo-toa
Qintaroth....... Beholders/Phaerimm DGTU
Ruins of Oghrann Formerly Shield Dwarfs/Now Gauths DGTU
Ruins of Tellectus Formerly MindFlayers DGTU
Sabrishon ... ???
Sloopdilmonpolp. Kuo-Toa......... UD/DGTU
Soubar ... map typo ... surface city
Sschindylrn's gate Portal to an Unknown plane DGTU
Sschindylryn ... Drow ... Menzo
Sshamath........ Drow............ UD/DGTU
Stoneshaft Clan. Dwarves......... DGTU
Thaalud Tunnels ... Tomb Tappers ??? ... FR13 Anauroch
The Great worm Cavern ... ???
The Lustrum ... ???
Therlarns fist ... ???
Torglor......... Githyanki....... UD/DGTU
Trollspear Clanhold ... Shield dwarves ... Lands of Intrigue / DDGttU
Tsenviilyq ... derro ... EE: THM
Uestingpool ... ???
Ullin'Tharnor ... ???
Ultoksamrin..... Formerly Shield Dwarf\ Now Drow followers of Vhaerun UD/DGTU
Ultoksurllur ... ???
Vault of the Star ruby ... deep gnomes ... Demihuman Deities
Viksanmaq....... Beholders/Phaerimm DGTU
Xothaerin....... Formerly Shield Dwarf/Now Stingers and Formorians UD/DGTU
Xunqaq.......... Beholders/Phaerimm DGTU
Zanhoriloch .... aboleth???
Zokir Beholders DGTU
Zz' Pzora's lair Formerly Deep Dragon Daughter of the Drow / DGTU |
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http://www.ericlboyd.com/dnd/ |
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Dargoth
Great Reader
Australia
4607 Posts |
Posted - 28 Apr 2004 : 01:55:45
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quote:
Originally posted by Alaundo
quote:
Originally posted by Lady Kazandra
This is great Dargoth .
Perhaps you should ask Alaundo to make this information available on the main site. It's a useful DM resource.
Well met
Indeed This is a great collection of lore that certainly deserves a place within the library. The original document would be greatly appreciated, Dargoth
ok Ill email it to you when its finished. |
“I am the King of Rome, and above grammar”
Emperor Sigismund
"Its good to be the King!"
Mel Brooks |
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Dargoth
Great Reader
Australia
4607 Posts |
Posted - 28 Apr 2004 : 02:55:53
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Thanks Eric
Where down to 10 unknowns
Glanderultok (under the Mountains South of the Turnback mountain range)
Iritaskar (under the Sunset Mountains near Sshamath)
Morndivver (under the Starspire mountains)
Nar'Vheen (Near Calaunt) This city may appear in Richard Bakers novel set in Ravens Bluff, can some one check as I can find mine
Sabrishon (Near Sshamath)
The Great Worm Cavern (NW of Menzo)
Therlarns fist (Near Sshamath)
Uestingpool (Near Sshamath)
Ullin'Tharnor (under the Great Glacier)
Ultoksurllur (Under the Starspire Mountains)
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“I am the King of Rome, and above grammar”
Emperor Sigismund
"Its good to be the King!"
Mel Brooks |
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Dargoth
Great Reader
Australia
4607 Posts |
Posted - 28 Apr 2004 : 04:13:00
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By the way, Eric thanks for that small bit of Serpent Kingdoms info
I almost missed it |
“I am the King of Rome, and above grammar”
Emperor Sigismund
"Its good to be the King!"
Mel Brooks |
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George Krashos
Master of Realmslore
Australia
6688 Posts |
Posted - 28 Apr 2004 : 05:19:21
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quote:
Originally posted by Dargoth
Iritaskar (under the Sunset Mountains near Sshamath)
Sabrishon (Near Sshamath)
Therlarns fist (Near Sshamath)
Uestingpool (Near Sshamath)
These four are from FR11 Dwarves Deep. They are the surviving clans of Oghrann in the Far Hills.
I've also managed to find one of Ed's references to a gnome kingdom (could have been deep gnomes also ..). It was called Oelerhode and was centred on present-day Owlhold in the Border Kingdoms. It was destroyed by orcs and existed "thousand of years ago". See Polyhedron#146.
-- George Krashos
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"Because only we, contrary to the barbarians, never count the enemy in battle." -- Aeschylus |
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Deep Gnome Cities
