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Bluenose
Learned Scribe
United Kingdom
134 Posts |
 Posted - 15 Dec 2005 : 17:03:30
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One of the players in my campaign has a female human PC who's been having sex with a male elf in the same campaign. The player had a conversation with me away from the game about the possibility that the PC was pregnant, and after a bit of discussion and dice rolling, she is. Does anyone have any information about how long the gestation period for a half elf is in these circumstances? Also, since she doesn't regard the elf as particularly reliable father figure  she isn't intending to stay with the group after they complete their current job. How long will it be before a) the PC can reasonably realise she's pregnant; and b) the other members of the group notice themselves?
Hoping someone can help.
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These, in the day when heaven was falling,
The hour when earth's foundations fled,
Followed their mercenary calling
And took their wages and are dead.
Their shoulders held the sky suspended;
They stood, and earth's foundations stay;
What God abandoned, these defended,
And saved the sum of things for pay. |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36989 Posts |
Posted - 15 Dec 2005 : 17:13:29
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| Since half-elves are essentially slightly souped-up humans, I'd make their gestation period be the same as a human's, or maybe a bit longer -- like about a month, if that long. |
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Kuje
Great Reader
USA
7915 Posts |
Posted - 15 Dec 2005 : 18:00:04
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I dimly recall that it was a year..... because humans are 9 months and elves are 2 years so half-elf would be a year.
The Book of Exotic Fantasy, yes it's not a official D&D book, also says a year for half-elves, 2 years (which we know is official because Ed has said it's 2 years) for elves, and 9 months for humans. |
For some of us, books are as important as almost anything else on earth. What a miracle it is that out of these small, flat, rigid squares of paper unfolds world after world, worlds that sing to you, comfort and quiet and excite you... Books are full of the things that you don't get in real life - wonderful, lyrical language, for instance, right off the bat. - Anne Lamott, Bird by Bird
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Fletcher
Learned Scribe
USA
299 Posts |
Posted - 15 Dec 2005 : 22:08:27
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quote:
Originally posted by Kuje
I dimly recall that it was a year..... because humans are 9 months and elves are 2 years so half-elf would be a year.
The Book of Exotic Fantasy, yes it's not a official D&D book, also says a year for half-elves, 2 years (which we know is official because Ed has said it's 2 years) for elves, and 9 months for humans.
Kuje is the knowledge master. He found his reference long before I could. I bow to the speedy regurgitation of knowledge.  |
Run faster! The Kobolds are catching up! |
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The Blue Sorceress
Learned Scribe
107 Posts |
Posted - 16 Dec 2005 : 00:26:07
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quote:
The Book of Exotic Fantasy, yes it's not a official D&D book, also says a year for half-elves, 2 years (which we know is official because Ed has said it's 2 years) for elves, and 9 months for humans.
I believe you meant the Book of Erotic Fantasy, Kuje. My players never seem to want to make babies. They're always too busy bickering amongst themselves and figuring out how to kill off various high-level NPC rulers.
-Blue |
Absolute Power Corrupts Absolutely.
I see your walrus and raise you a carpenter |
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Kuje
Great Reader
USA
7915 Posts |
Posted - 16 Dec 2005 : 00:51:42
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quote:
Originally posted by The Blue Sorceress
quote:
The Book of Exotic Fantasy, yes it's not a official D&D book, also says a year for half-elves, 2 years (which we know is official because Ed has said it's 2 years) for elves, and 9 months for humans.
I believe you meant the Book of Erotic Fantasy, Kuje. My players never seem to want to make babies. They're always too busy bickering amongst themselves and figuring out how to kill off various high-level NPC rulers.
-Blue
I did. :) I knew it looked off but I couldn't figure out why and my copy is buried somewhere under one of these stacks, so I didn't check. Plus I was only half-awake at the time I wrote that. |
For some of us, books are as important as almost anything else on earth. What a miracle it is that out of these small, flat, rigid squares of paper unfolds world after world, worlds that sing to you, comfort and quiet and excite you... Books are full of the things that you don't get in real life - wonderful, lyrical language, for instance, right off the bat. - Anne Lamott, Bird by Bird
Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium |
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Bluenose
Learned Scribe
United Kingdom
134 Posts |
Posted - 16 Dec 2005 : 14:38:28
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quote:
Originally posted by Fletcher
quote:
Originally posted by Kuje
I dimly recall that it was a year..... because humans are 9 months and elves are 2 years so half-elf would be a year.
The Book of Exotic Fantasy, yes it's not a official D&D book, also says a year for half-elves, 2 years (which we know is official because Ed has said it's 2 years) for elves, and 9 months for humans.
Kuje is the knowledge master. He found his reference long before I could. I bow to the speedy regurgitation of knowledge.
A year sounds about right to me too. I'll go with that, and for stages just add about 1/3 to a human pregnancy. Thanks for the information. |
These, in the day when heaven was falling,
The hour when earth's foundations fled,
Followed their mercenary calling
And took their wages and are dead.
Their shoulders held the sky suspended;
They stood, and earth's foundations stay;
What God abandoned, these defended,
And saved the sum of things for pay. |
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Dhomal
Senior Scribe
USA
565 Posts |
Posted - 17 Dec 2005 : 06:46:45
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Hello-
Interesting. The female Human PC will have a 3-month longer pregnancy....
Somehow - I would have thought that the pregnancy times would be based on the race of the mother. In that way - a half elf MOther would have the 9-month gestation period - while the Elven mother of a to-be-born half elf child would still have the 2-year period. Just the ay I had always looked at it - as opposed to the race of the baby. Seems like an Elven woman might fancy a human dalliance just to halve her length of pregnancy! LOL
Dhomal |
I am collecting the D&D Minis. I would be more than willing to trade with people. You can send me a PM here with your email listed - and I can send you my minis list. Thanks!
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KnightErrantJR
Great Reader
USA
5402 Posts |
Posted - 17 Dec 2005 : 10:56:43
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I was kind of thinking that the mother's races should play a bit of a role in the matter myself. The child would grow at a rate that the mother's body could provide it its nutrients and the like, so I would almost be incline to perhaps take the average of the normal gestation of a human. Half elves are actually lighter and more compact than humans, so a human might be able to allow them to grow faster than an elven mother, with her more delicate constitution, could. In which case it would go back to the normal gestation (9 months for human, 2 years for elves).
But I could be completely off. Its hard to make pronouncements on human women giving birth to non human children, since there isn't much of a precedence for it outside of fantasy, Star Trek, or the Weely World News . . . |
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The Blue Sorceress
Learned Scribe
107 Posts |
Posted - 17 Dec 2005 : 11:38:49
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quote:
Originally posted by Kuje
quote:
Originally posted by The Blue Sorceress
I believe you meant the Book of Erotic Fantasy, Kuje. My players never seem to want to make babies. They're always too busy bickering amongst themselves and figuring out how to kill off various high-level NPC rulers.
-Blue
I did. :) I knew it looked off but I couldn't figure out why and my copy is buried somewhere under one of these stacks, so I didn't check. Plus I was only half-awake at the time I wrote that.
I'm only half-awake always, but I'm majoring in English at a college that specializes in that subject, so I'm a compulsive editor. I know that some people visiting these lofty halls of knowledge can't handle a visit to the Boards That Shall Not Be Named for one reason or another, but I'm willing to wager that I'm the only one who can only rarely stand to peek in because the spelling and grammar hurts somewhere deep down in my soul. 
Point being, I hope I didn't hurt your feelings or anything. If I did consider this a formal apology.
Now, regarding the production (and reproduction) of half-elves!
The way I figure it, no matter what the mother's species the gestation period will be the same because the fetus needs a certain amount of time to develop in the womb before it is mature enough to survive outside of it. The fact that the mother is human or elven should have no bearing on the time it takes a half-elven fetus to fully develop.
In general, the closer a baby is to being delivered full-term the better off it is. There's been some recent study to suggest that a higher percentage of premature infants suffer from cognitive deficiencies than those who were delievered full-term.
I'm willing to bank on the idea that the same can be said of elven and half-elven infants. Thus, if the normal gestation period for a half-elven fetus is a year, then the closer the date of birth is to a year after the date of conception the more likely it is that the baby will be healthy.
On another note, I think that it would be a more accurate depiction of the blending of the two races if the half-elven gestation period was closer to sixteen and a half months, rather than twelve. My reasoning is that 16.5 is half way between 9, the gestation period of a human fetus, and 24 months, the gestation period of an elven fetus. I even did math!
24 - 9 = 15
15/2 = 7.5
9 + 7.5 = 16.5 = 24 - 7.5
This is something of a tangent here, but I'd imagine that the offspring of a human and a half-elf would probably be have a gestation period of closer to a year than a full half-elf would, regardless of whether said half-elf was produced either an elf/human couple or a half-elf/half-elf couple or what have you. Though a human/half-elf child would be "human" in terms of the game rules regarding race, at least one quarter of its genetic makeup woud be elven, resulting in a longer lifespan, slower maturation, and longer gestation than a full-blooded human child, but a shorter lifespan, faster maturation, and shorter gestation than a half-elven child.
Yay half-elves!
-Blue |
Absolute Power Corrupts Absolutely.
I see your walrus and raise you a carpenter |
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Aelf
Acolyte
USA
46 Posts |
Posted - 17 Dec 2005 : 14:12:31
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I feel like Sir Bedevere for trying to invoke science, but I did google a bit to determine actual cross-species gestation duration. (The only example I could think of was horse x ass = mule.)
As some have already pointed out, the expected hybrid gestation duration is between those of the parent species.
A horse is 11 months, and a donkey 12 (though some said 11-14).
Unfortunately, this is pretty narrow and doesn't shed any more light on what kind of mean to shoot for.
Blue suggested an arithmetic mean: (9+24)/2 = 16.5 months
Another option might be a geometric mean: sqrt(9*24) = 14.7 months (rounded)
For those who would like to know more about mules:
(that is, until we see a d20 "Races of Livestock" or "Mules, Half-elves and other Hybrids" or perhaps "1001 Mounts and Natural Allies")
http://www.imh.org/imh/bw/mule.html
http://www.ruralheritage.com/mule_paddock/mule_compare.htm
http://ladywildlife.com/animal/donkey.html
Aelf,
friendly neighborhood bard
(Edit: fixed typo) |
Regards,
Aelf, a bard of the Realms |
Edited by - Aelf on 17 Dec 2005 15:03:23 |
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Crennen FaerieBane
Master of Realmslore
USA
1378 Posts |
Posted - 17 Dec 2005 : 16:11:25
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Right on! I'm back in Calc class! Who ever said math had no place in Forgotten Realms?
C-Fb |
Still rockin' the Fey'ri style. |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36989 Posts |
Posted - 17 Dec 2005 : 17:41:15
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quote:
Originally posted by The Blue Sorceress
On another note, I think that it would be a more accurate depiction of the blending of the two races if the half-elven gestation period was closer to sixteen and a half months, rather than twelve. My reasoning is that 16.5 is half way between 9, the gestation period of a human fetus, and 24 months, the gestation period of an elven fetus. I even did math!
24 - 9 = 15
15/2 = 7.5
9 + 7.5 = 16.5 = 24 - 7.5
The reason I didn't go for that math is because you could see the gestation period as being a rough parallel to the lifespan. Elves live several times longer than humans, so they would have the longer gestational period.
That's why I figured 10 months or so.... |
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Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
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Kuje
Great Reader
USA
7915 Posts |
Posted - 17 Dec 2005 : 17:49:53
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quote:
Originally posted by The Blue Sorceress
quote:
Originally posted by Kuje
quote:
Originally posted by The Blue Sorceress
I believe you meant the Book of Erotic Fantasy, Kuje. My players never seem to want to make babies. They're always too busy bickering amongst themselves and figuring out how to kill off various high-level NPC rulers.
-Blue
I did. :) I knew it looked off but I couldn't figure out why and my copy is buried somewhere under one of these stacks, so I didn't check. Plus I was only half-awake at the time I wrote that.
I'm only half-awake always, but I'm majoring in English at a college that specializes in that subject, so I'm a compulsive editor. I know that some people visiting these lofty halls of knowledge can't handle a visit to the Boards That Shall Not Be Named for one reason or another, but I'm willing to wager that I'm the only one who can only rarely stand to peek in because the spelling and grammar hurts somewhere deep down in my soul.
Point being, I hope I didn't hurt your feelings or anything. If I did consider this a formal apology.
No worries. I should have double checked but as I said, I didn't and so someone caught me. :) |
For some of us, books are as important as almost anything else on earth. What a miracle it is that out of these small, flat, rigid squares of paper unfolds world after world, worlds that sing to you, comfort and quiet and excite you... Books are full of the things that you don't get in real life - wonderful, lyrical language, for instance, right off the bat. - Anne Lamott, Bird by Bird
Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium |
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Rinonalyrna Fathomlin
Great Reader
USA
7106 Posts |
Posted - 17 Dec 2005 : 20:53:51
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I know it's fantasy, but I didn't think real-world gestation had anything to do with lifespan.
Then again, I could be wrong. |
"Instead of asking why we sleep, it might make sense to ask why we wake. Perchance we live to dream. From that perspective, the sea of troubles we navigate in the workaday world might be the price we pay for admission to another night in the world of dreams."
--Richard Greene (letter to Time) |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36989 Posts |
Posted - 17 Dec 2005 : 21:08:34
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quote:
Originally posted by Rinonalyrna Fathomlin
I know it's fantasy, but I didn't think real-world gestation had anything to do with lifespan.
Then again, I could be wrong.
Who said anything about real-world? I was merely looking at the fact that elves, who live considerably longer than humans, have a much longer gestational period. The numbers aren't a direct correlation, but there is a notably longer period of time for the bun to be in the oven. |
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Rinonalyrna Fathomlin
Great Reader
USA
7106 Posts |
Posted - 17 Dec 2005 : 21:31:35
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| Hey Wooly, I wasn't talking to you specifically, I was just making a general comment. I didn't mean to get under your skin or anything. |
"Instead of asking why we sleep, it might make sense to ask why we wake. Perchance we live to dream. From that perspective, the sea of troubles we navigate in the workaday world might be the price we pay for admission to another night in the world of dreams."
--Richard Greene (letter to Time) |
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Crennen FaerieBane
Master of Realmslore
USA
1378 Posts |
Posted - 17 Dec 2005 : 22:15:43
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quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
quote:
Originally posted by Rinonalyrna Fathomlin
I know it's fantasy, but I didn't think real-world gestation had anything to do with lifespan.
Then again, I could be wrong.
Who said anything about real-world? I was merely looking at the fact that elves, who live considerably longer than humans, have a much longer gestational period. The numbers aren't a direct correlation, but there is a notably longer period of time for the bun to be in the oven.
I agree. Look at the mammals around now - it does seem that there is a direct corelation with the time the bun is in the oven to lifespan. We have one of the longest gestation periods on Earth, and we are also one of the most long-lived. I'm sure this translates over to Elves, if not Dragons and other creatures.
However, there could be arguements that because humanoids all have the same basic systems (brain, lungs, etc.) they should take about the same time to develop within the womb. But hey, it's fantasy - I just take it how it's told to me. I have enough RL to worry about!
C-Fb |
Still rockin' the Fey'ri style. |
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Aelf
Acolyte
USA
46 Posts |
Posted - 17 Dec 2005 : 23:05:11
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For land mammals (excluding marsupials for obvious reasons) there does seen to be some correlation between adult size and gestation duration; but there is also some definite clustering of orders (primates > carnivores > rodenta, in general)
Bats are odd: 5-6 months is the normal figure quoted.
Whales are also odd, 10-11 is commonly noted, but an Orca in captivity took 17.
I guess my conclusion here is that there doesn't seem to be a 'law' that generalizes gestation periods across species. More power to the authors and DMs who mold fantastic reality!
Anyways, I'm a math guy not a zoologist.
Aelf,
friendly neighborhood bard
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Regards,
Aelf, a bard of the Realms |
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Thureen Buroch
Learned Scribe
169 Posts |
Posted - 18 Dec 2005 : 02:09:51
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| Half elves are sterile, right? |
Goblins? *Slash* *Scream* *Thunk* What goblins? |
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Kuje
Great Reader
USA
7915 Posts |
Posted - 18 Dec 2005 : 02:24:17
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quote:
Originally posted by Thureen Buroch
Half elves are sterile, right?
Not in FR. |
For some of us, books are as important as almost anything else on earth. What a miracle it is that out of these small, flat, rigid squares of paper unfolds world after world, worlds that sing to you, comfort and quiet and excite you... Books are full of the things that you don't get in real life - wonderful, lyrical language, for instance, right off the bat. - Anne Lamott, Bird by Bird
Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium |
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Rinonalyrna Fathomlin
Great Reader
USA
7106 Posts |
Posted - 18 Dec 2005 : 02:28:33
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quote:
Originally posted by Thureen Buroch
Half elves are sterile, right?
Nope! Not at all, at least in the Forgotten Realms.
I did some research on this. The best I could find online was the fact that mammalian gestation periods vary greatly (btw, elephants gestate for two years--way longer than humans). Nothing was mentioned about gestation periods correlating with either adult size or with how long-lived the animal is.
Hey, I've read that the longest lived animal is that giant tortoise, and they aren't even born live, they hatch from eggs. But like Aelf I don't claim to be an expert zoologist, just an animal lover who has interest in the subject. I don't have an axe to grind about this at all, I just am not sure that correlating gestation periods with lifespan is "the right way to go" or anything. |
"Instead of asking why we sleep, it might make sense to ask why we wake. Perchance we live to dream. From that perspective, the sea of troubles we navigate in the workaday world might be the price we pay for admission to another night in the world of dreams."
--Richard Greene (letter to Time) |
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Kentinal
Great Reader
4703 Posts |
Posted - 18 Dec 2005 : 02:42:00
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Well Real World does not apply at all as far as that goes concerning half=elves. Also though should be noted that 9 months human is hardly a firm rule for Real Life Humans as to time they give natural birth, it is just an average.
The one year average appears to be fair, three extra months required because of elven blood atribute slowing the development of a baby a little. |
"Small beings can have small wisdom," the dragon said. "And small wise beings are better than small fools. Listen: Wisdom is caring for afterwards."
"Caring for afterwards ...? Ker repeated this without understanding.
"After action, afterwards," the dragon said. "Choose the afterwards first, then the action. Fools choose action first."
"Judgement" copyright 2003 by Elizabeth Moon |
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Gestation Period for Half Elves
