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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36876 Posts |
 Posted - 23 Jan 2007 : 18:12:07
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Honestly, in a world where names are usually made-up words, I don't see much of an issue with the *occasional* name that comes from the real world. It stands to reason that at some point, some random mother will put together some sounds in the exact same way that originally happened in the real world.
I'm not saying that I'd not cringe at seeing "Fred Smith" the fighter in a novel, but, at the same time, I don't have as much of an issue with a single character having a real world name, particularly one that isn't terribly common in RL. So Fred Smith would bug me, but Gareth is, to me, acceptable.
It also must be taken into account that when the H series was started, it wasn't FR-specific -- so it didn't have to follow FR naming conventions. It would have been better if it did, obviously, but that wasn't the case. We may not be happy with the names, but I think there are other aspects of the Realms that are more worthy of our attention. |
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Gellion
Learned Scribe
140 Posts |
Posted - 23 Jan 2007 : 21:20:36
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quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
I'm not saying that I'd not cringe at seeing "Fred Smith" the fighter in a novel, but, at the same time, I don't have as much of an issue with a single character having a real world name, particularly one that isn't terribly common in RL. So Fred Smith would bug me, but Gareth is, to me, acceptable.
I had never heard the name Gareth before reading RoTP, so it did not seem jarring to me at all. |
"Paladine, you see the evil that surrounds me! You have been witness to the calamities that have been the scourge of Krynn... You must see now that this doctrine of balance will not work! I can sweep evil from this land. Destroy the ogre races. Bring the wayward humans into line! Find new homelands far away for the dwarves and the kender and the gnomes, those races not of your creation... I demand that you give me, too, the power to drive away the shadows of evil that darken the land!"- THE REIGN OF ISTAR, Tales IV |
Edited by - Gellion on 23 Jan 2007 21:21:17 |
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Richard Lee Byers
Forgotten Realms Author
USA
1814 Posts |
Posted - 23 Jan 2007 : 21:54:26
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| Gareth is the name of one of King Arthur's knights, one of Gawain's brothers. I think the name is Welsh, but I could be wrong. |
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Archwizard
Learned Scribe
USA
266 Posts |
Posted - 23 Jan 2007 : 22:07:35
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Gareth and Kane are alright. Some more canon Realms names are similar if not worse than these in committing the too-close-to-reality sin. (Though I can't stand the name of Gareth's wife, Christine, in the Realms. Even if I like the name in the real world).
How a novel on the Bloodstone characters would turn out really depends on the writer and beyond that the execution. All the same, the author could be a newcomer and still do it "right" if they tried while even a longtime proven Realms author could mess up depending on the situation. If an author went about it with respect to both the Realms and the original module, it could turn out great, perhaps even iron out some of the more jarring bits. Say if they mentioned "Christine" was actually some sort of nickname and her real name is as Realmsian as Alassra or Jhessail. If the author could handle the storytelling of epic characters with the depth of how Ed handles issues with the Chosen, then even better.
I wouldn't put down the idea just because the modules didn't start as part of the Realms and weren't intended for it. Look at the Moonshaes. |
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KnightErrantJR
Great Reader
USA
5402 Posts |
Posted - 23 Jan 2007 : 22:09:41
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| Speaking of Richard Lee Byers . . . given that I really liked the parts of the Year of Rogue Dragons that took place in Damara, I'd vote for him if this project ever came to pass, but I would guess its unlikely . . . so my NEW vote would be to lock RLB in a room with George Krashos and have them hammer out an Impiltur novel . . . |
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Archwizard
Learned Scribe
USA
266 Posts |
Posted - 23 Jan 2007 : 22:21:33
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quote:
Originally posted by KnightErrantJR
. . . so my NEW vote would be to lock RLB in a room with George Krashos and have them hammer out an Impiltur novel . . .
Seconded |
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Richard Lee Byers
Forgotten Realms Author
USA
1814 Posts |
Posted - 23 Jan 2007 : 23:17:46
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Do we have to finish the whole darn novel before you let us out? If so, I want hardship pay and I imagine George would, too.
But thanks for the vote of confidence. |
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Rinonalyrna Fathomlin
Great Reader
USA
7106 Posts |
Posted - 24 Jan 2007 : 00:07:15
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| "Celedon Kierney" is the name that I never thought quite fit in (mainly the surname) as well as being annoying, though I too have to agree that "Queen Christine" is incredibly jarring and out of place for the Realms. |
"Instead of asking why we sleep, it might make sense to ask why we wake. Perchance we live to dream. From that perspective, the sea of troubles we navigate in the workaday world might be the price we pay for admission to another night in the world of dreams."
--Richard Greene (letter to Time) |
Edited by - Rinonalyrna Fathomlin on 24 Jan 2007 00:12:26 |
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KnightErrantJR
Great Reader
USA
5402 Posts |
Posted - 24 Jan 2007 : 00:18:48
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quote:
Originally posted by Richard Lee Byers
Do we have to finish the whole darn novel before you let us out? If so, I want hardship pay and I imagine George would, too.
But thanks for the vote of confidence.
Maybe we could let you have one of those ankle bracelet electronic doohickies so you could have weekends with the family and friends, but thats it . . .  |
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mavericace
Seeker
USA
84 Posts |
Posted - 24 Jan 2007 : 05:50:41
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| maybe we could just clone RLB? |
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Jorkens
Great Reader
Norway
2950 Posts |
Posted - 24 Jan 2007 : 07:33:06
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| The problem with using rare names is that the use of it might bring different reactions as to where you are in the world. To me, Gareth makes me think of modern Britain (mostly Wales) at once. The same goes for many of the Norse names, to me their not actually foreign and brings a real world reference at once. With clear fantasy names you run the risk of by mistake making a word that is ridiculous in one language, but that is still better in my opinion. |
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Weiser_Cain
Seeker
87 Posts |
Posted - 24 Jan 2007 : 10:48:38
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I like Salvatore.
I Love epic.
Yet somehow I never heard of this. |
I'm always the Wizard! |
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Rinonalyrna Fathomlin
Great Reader
USA
7106 Posts |
Posted - 24 Jan 2007 : 22:50:36
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quote:
Originally posted by Jorkens
The problem with using rare names is that the use of it might bring different reactions as to where you are in the world. To me, Gareth makes me think of modern Britain (mostly Wales) at once. The same goes for many of the Norse names, to me their not actually foreign and brings a real world reference at once. With clear fantasy names you run the risk of by mistake making a word that is ridiculous in one language, but that is still better in my opinion.
I agree--"exotic" to one person is perfectly normal to someone else, depending on what culture they're from...and people from more than just one culture read these books. What evokes "the real world" is different for every reader, it seems. |
"Instead of asking why we sleep, it might make sense to ask why we wake. Perchance we live to dream. From that perspective, the sea of troubles we navigate in the workaday world might be the price we pay for admission to another night in the world of dreams."
--Richard Greene (letter to Time) |
Edited by - Rinonalyrna Fathomlin on 24 Jan 2007 22:51:29 |
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Delzounblood
Senior Scribe
United Kingdom
578 Posts |
Posted - 24 Jan 2007 : 23:27:13
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Originally posted by jordanz
I mean we constantly talk about these uber powerful planar and evil mages and such but where is the counter to opose these beings? Elmister and the Chosen can't be every where and the Dritzz's of the realm are not quite powerful enough. There have got to be OTHERS. Well I'd like to see some of them in action...
I second This
Delz
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I'm Back! |
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Delzounblood
Senior Scribe
United Kingdom
578 Posts |
Posted - 24 Jan 2007 : 23:29:54
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quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
I don't see such a tale being written for one simple reason: WotC (and TSR before them) has a habit of keeping novels set in the here and now. Old tales -- even something as recent as Bane's return -- generally are ignored in favor of moving the timeline forward.
Why ?
If WotC DID recap's of history or re-visits in time, wouldn't that fill in the blanks? and by default, of all of us buying the damn books, make them a shed load of money!
WHY DON'T THEY LISTEN
Delz
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36876 Posts |
Posted - 24 Jan 2007 : 23:33:35
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quote:
Originally posted by Delzounblood
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
I don't see such a tale being written for one simple reason: WotC (and TSR before them) has a habit of keeping novels set in the here and now. Old tales -- even something as recent as Bane's return -- generally are ignored in favor of moving the timeline forward.
Why ?
If WotC DID recap's of history or re-visits in time, wouldn't that fill in the blanks? and by default, of all of us buying the damn books, make them a shed load of money!
WHY DON'T THEY LISTEN
Delz
They did that with the Dragginglance series. And, though novels kept coming out, the setting stagnanted. By keeping the novels in the here-and-now, they keep the timeline moving forward. As long as stuff is happening in the world, people will stay interested and keep buying products. |
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Delzounblood
Senior Scribe
United Kingdom
578 Posts |
Posted - 24 Jan 2007 : 23:41:25
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quote:
Originally posted by Faraer
* One more reason not to give more attention to a group created by people who didn't even know about Realms naming conventions.
"Realms Naming Conventions" ?????????
Faraer, surely any"thing/one" can be named whatever!!!!
I've had characters named:
Sir Daemon (Huamn)
Garth (Human)
Garyth (Human)
GizzButt (Human)
Llwanthar Markil III (Half Elf)
Moreuun (Halfling)
Delzounblood( Dwarf)
Bombour (Dwarf)
KGRAAGGHHH (try saying that after a beer or 6, by the way it was an Orc)
Harley Quinn (Kender)
Imman or imaninventorofvariousweaponsofmassdestructionjustasmyforefatherswerebeforemeandasmychildrenwillbeafterihavediedandmyboneshavedecomposedtonothingbutdusttheseventeeth. (GNOME)
I was never aware you had to conform to a naming convention !!!!
Delz
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I'm Back! |
Edited by - Delzounblood on 24 Jan 2007 23:42:45 |
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jordanz
Senior Scribe
556 Posts |
Posted - 25 Jan 2007 : 03:08:53
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Wooly,
So you think there's consensus agreement amoungst the publishers that if a particular storyline predates the current Realms timeline, readers will lose interest in the present day realms? Perhaps a case of the past overshadowing the present?
I mean there are tons of references made to all these legendary past events "Hell gate Keep", "Fall of Myth Drannor"
"the Crown Wars", or really early stuff like the first use of Magic in the realms but we never get the FULL details. Instead we get TEASED.
Is it just me or do you agree that these events are what piqued interest in the realms to begin with. Maybe there is a fear of removing the "mystery" of the realms by revealing too much? Or maybe there are not enough authors out there who want the challenge of chronicling these epic tales?
Ofcourse there have been a novels that have recounted past events. Some good - "Netheril trilogy" and some lame "Sammaster Dragon stuff" but I think that has more to do with the author, not the setting.
Heck, why not start a line, call it "Legends of the Realms" and recount all the cool stuff in full detail? I'd buy that over most of the garbage we are getting in the "Fighters" or "Wizards" series. |
Edited by - jordanz on 25 Jan 2007 13:46:00 |
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Jorkens
Great Reader
Norway
2950 Posts |
Posted - 25 Jan 2007 : 07:22:25
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Well, they did a few books dealing more with the past in the late 90's. As it has been decided that this will not be done anymore, the sales can not have been to great.
I personally lost interest in the Dragonlance setting when they started to move forward, but I am in the minority there. One of the things I did like about the "historic" Dragonlance novels was that the stories were not always large historic events.
Now, I would have loved to see a novel from the golden age of the dwarves, gnomish refugees from Netherill, the tragedy of Sessrendale, but most readers would not. And if it was done it would probably be done over the top anyway. |
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Faraer
Great Reader
3308 Posts |
Posted - 25 Jan 2007 : 19:56:04
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No consensus, just a strategy for Realms novels at Wizards of the Coast. Who says most readers wouldn't like books set in the 'past'? It works for Dragonlance, and the mediocre Netheril novels (and game products) were hardly a fair sales test.
Now, to some extent Realms novel readers have been led to expect books in the (I think increasingly implausible) WotC 'present'. But that's not necessary or irreversible.
Delzounblood, you never noticed that character and place names in the Realms -- like every other secondary world and like our own -- have a distinctive range of style? |
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Aureus
Learned Scribe
Luxembourg
125 Posts |
Posted - 25 Jan 2007 : 21:02:47
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| this makes me think, would "Victor" work as a realmsian name? |
That is not the weirdest thing that happened to me |
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Faraer
Great Reader
3308 Posts |
Posted - 25 Jan 2007 : 21:41:29
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| It could be a nickname, or an unusual given name. But it isn't a standard name, and the problem is that readers are liable to interpret it that way, inferring a false familiarity. |
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If you could pick the author to Chronicle
