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Dargoth
Great Reader
Australia
4607 Posts |
 Posted - 23 Dec 2004 : 06:34:22
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The Following Domains in the Complete Divine havent been assigned to any FR deities (BOVD and BOED where realmisifed in the PGTF) Which Deitied do you think should have these Domains
My Picks
Celerity: No idea
Competition: Lathander
Creation: Lathander
Domination: Bane (Does dovetail nicely if you take the Tyranny Domain)
Dream: No idea
Force: No idea
Inquisition: Maybe Bane?
Liberation: No idea
Madness: Cyric? (Although hes no longer Mad)
Mind: Mind Flayer Deity (Starts with I) and Deep Duerra
Mysticism: No idea
Oracle: Savras
Pact: No idea
Pestilince: Talona and Yurtus
Purification: Gods with Paladins
Summoner: No idea
Weather: Talos, Umberlee, Auril
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31799 Posts |
Posted - 23 Dec 2004 : 07:08:06
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quote:
Originally posted by Dargoth
Mind: Mind Flayer Deity (Starts with I) and Deep Duerra
Ilsensine. And it already does, at least, according to the XPsiHB.
Good pick  .
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31799 Posts |
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Bookwyrm
Great Reader
USA
4740 Posts |
Posted - 23 Dec 2004 : 07:15:53
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Hmm . . . good idea. Ought to do some more FRing, and here's a good place to start.
Offhand, though, Liberation should go to Lliira. |
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31799 Posts |
Posted - 23 Dec 2004 : 07:29:59
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quote:
Originally posted by Bookwyrm
Hmm . . . good idea. Ought to do some more FRing, and here's a good place to start.
Offhand, though, Liberation should go to Lliira.
Seems like a good choice.
With a little fudging, I suppose Liberation could also relate to some worshippers of Sune as well. Especially for worshippers who may have been forced into lives of servitude... and have been unable to express themselves fully because of this fact.
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Dargoth
Great Reader
Australia
4607 Posts |
Posted - 23 Dec 2004 : 07:51:24
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| Inquisition might be a good one for Tyr as hes the God Justice |
“I am the King of Rome, and above grammar”
Emperor Sigismund
"Its good to be the King!"
Mel Brooks |
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31799 Posts |
Posted - 23 Dec 2004 : 07:57:11
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quote:
Originally posted by Dargoth
Inquisition might be a good one for Tyr as hes the God Justice
That may be the better option actually, since inquisitions are not always so strict about honour and loyalty. The primary concern for an inquisition is to ferret out the truth and establish a "kind" of law. It's more fitting for Tyr, than it is for Torm. Such an domain assignment for Torm would likely cause problems for his clerics at some point in their careers. And it would likely be a conflict between their honour and the pursuit of justice.
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Dargoth
Great Reader
Australia
4607 Posts |
Posted - 23 Dec 2004 : 08:02:09
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| Id definately give Torm Purification |
“I am the King of Rome, and above grammar”
Emperor Sigismund
"Its good to be the King!"
Mel Brooks |
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31799 Posts |
Posted - 23 Dec 2004 : 08:08:12
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quote:
Originally posted by Dargoth
Id definately give Torm Purification
Honour, loyalty, ... and purification. It's certainly an interesting addition. Although, it could be used by Tormite clerics as a justification for an inquisition against evil lords who have little honour and no loyalty to the people they subjugate.
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Dargoth
Great Reader
Australia
4607 Posts |
Posted - 23 Dec 2004 : 08:24:28
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| Torms a bit of a Crusader so Purification is probably a valid portfolio or him |
“I am the King of Rome, and above grammar”
Emperor Sigismund
"Its good to be the King!"
Mel Brooks |
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Alparon
Seeker
Turkey
67 Posts |
Posted - 24 Dec 2004 : 00:04:03
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i think we must have a better nickname for
"Lawful Good"
than "crusader"
it may be insulting for us; you know the crusades were not that holy for muslims
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I am Cyric, the One and the All, God of Murder and Intrigue, Patron of Deception and Chaos, Prince of Lies, the Dark Sun, rightful Lord of the Dead, Cyric-on-a-stick, and known to some as "the Mad God." I welcome you to The Land of the Dead... |
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Dargoth
Great Reader
Australia
4607 Posts |
Posted - 24 Dec 2004 : 00:27:59
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quote:
Originally posted by Alparon
i think we must have a better nickname for
"Lawful Good"
than "crusader"
it may be insulting for us; you know the crusades were not that holy for muslims
I suggest you read Elaine Cunninghams novel Thornhold Lawfulgood does not mean Holy (As the Paladins in the novel well demonstrate) |
“I am the King of Rome, and above grammar”
Emperor Sigismund
"Its good to be the King!"
Mel Brooks |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36965 Posts |
Posted - 24 Dec 2004 : 01:07:56
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| Further, the term crusade has become a generic one, basically meaning a cause that one follows quite strongly. |
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Dargoth
Great Reader
Australia
4607 Posts |
Posted - 24 Dec 2004 : 04:30:50
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| We'll judging by what Rich Baker said it looks like the FR team has no intention of officially assigning the CD domains to any FR deity. |
“I am the King of Rome, and above grammar”
Emperor Sigismund
"Its good to be the King!"
Mel Brooks |
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Bookwyrm
Great Reader
USA
4740 Posts |
Posted - 24 Dec 2004 : 07:30:51
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Oh, my! Dargoth is a "Doublemint Twin!" 
As for crusading, one of the common misconceptions about the Holy Crusades was that they were not a war against Muslims. That's something I've seen spread by a lot of Christian-haters and revisionists, especially those who hate Catholics. (It's really odd, because it's like the Galileo thing; there, the Protestants rejected him faster and more completely than Catholics, and they later painted it to show how Roman Catholics are anti-science, etc. (when the trial was actually about Galileo's politics, for lack of a better term). Similarly, I've seen some Protestants rail about the Crusades and then turn around and proclaim that Islam is devil-worship. Some, mind you -- but they're pretty loud.)
Anyway, the Crusades were supposed to be -- and this is the only part that the Roman Catholic Church sactioned or encouraged in any way -- about retaking the Holy lands (basically, Israel). Not one bit more. Of course, due to extremely poor communication and even poorer planing, all of the Crusades actually just made things worse. (Well, except for the Venicians. They made a net gain doing water-taxi service.  ) I've actually read some accounts written by Catholics that really show how stupid the whole affair was. And all it really started with was a pope saying "It'd be really nice if we had Jerusalem back," not "Oh, those Muslims are stinking up the place, let's go kill them." (That might have been what the soldiers were thinking, but it wasn't supposed to be like that.)
Just goes to show how easily good intentions pave the road to that other place  Which is exactly what was shown in Thornhold, as Dargoth pointed out. Many people consider their cause to be so right that they feel that anyone who stands in the way is an enemy to be struck down. This can either be due to an evil thing (such as Hitler, the classic Real Life lawful evil villian), or due to a good thing (wanting to spread your faith by killing off non-believers, something that Christianity did cause, due to a number of things that have since been identified and removed.)
A theocracy is, on the face of it (if you're really religious) a good thing, but once you look deeper you can see how easily it turns around. Anyone ever hear the song One Tin Soldier? There's a line in it that always sticks out to me: "Do it in the name of Heaven / You can justify it in the end." Once you believe that anything you do is right, and you can never be wrong, you are almost guaranteed to be wrong at least most of the time. Human nature is just like that.
Not to mention the nature of D&D gods -- remember Lathander? There was a crusade right there, to use the term as it exists today (before, it came from the Latin word for "cross"). He believed he had everything right, and that everyone should be like him. He was shown the error of his ways. Not that he seems to have paid a lot of attention, but he was shown.
The term as used in the PHB means "person who believes in the forces of right and good, and works to actively spread it." Of course, as I mentioned elsewhere just recently, the alignment system is too restrictive. Lawful Good could be a number of things -- not just a person who wants to make everyone else Lawful Good. You could have a "lawful" mercenary who fights for one army one week, and for that army's enemy the next week -- because once the contract is up, he's free to choose a new employer. Once he's bought, he'll stay bought, but when he's a free agent, he takes the most money. That's still Lawful.
Probably not Lawful Good, of course, nor is it likely Lawful Evil. It could be, though. Say, a lawful good carpenter who is contracted for his previous employer's competitor; he has no reason to give a lower quality of work, because he has no particular loyalty to the previous employer. Now, if that employer had secrets, he wouldn't give them up, nor would he spy for that previous employer no matter what he was offered. A lawful evil character in the same situation might accept a bribe -- as, say, an alternate "contract" -- to sabatoge that new guy's order . . . but only if the person with the bribe offers him enough money to compensate him for the risk and trouble. Or the LE character would just offer the lower limit of quality and charge as much as he could get away with.
None of that is suggested by the PHB. If you just go by those rules, all you have a choice of, between LG and LE, is a religiously "good" person (basically, a stereotypical paladin, whatever the class actually taken), or a guy who only wants to bend the world to his rule. In reality -- game reality, even, not just Real Life -- the choices are simply so much more numerous as to near limitless.
In fact, one of my favorite villians that I've read about on Candlekeep was one used by the now-departed Mournblade: a paladin. No, not a fallen paladin, I mean a real Lawful Good still-got-his-spurs paladin. If that's not a stereotype breaker, I challenge you to give me one. |
Hell hath no fury like all of Candlekeep rising in defense of one of its own.
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Dargoth
Great Reader
Australia
4607 Posts |
Posted - 24 Dec 2004 : 07:40:14
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| DoubleMint twin? What the hell does that mean? |
“I am the King of Rome, and above grammar”
Emperor Sigismund
"Its good to be the King!"
Mel Brooks |
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Purple Dragon Knight
Master of Realmslore
Canada
1796 Posts |
Posted - 24 Dec 2004 : 07:46:41
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quote:
Originally posted by Dargoth
We'll judging by what Rich Baker said it looks like the FR team has no intention of officially assigning the CD domains to any FR deity.
Amen to that! |
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Bookwyrm
Great Reader
USA
4740 Posts |
Posted - 24 Dec 2004 : 08:22:29
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quote:
Originally posted by Dargoth
DoubleMint twin? What the hell does that mean?
  
 I feel old . . . .
I was referring to the old Doublemint Gum commercials. They'd have a bunch of twins on them. It became a standard to see twins and think "Doublemint Gum." (Which was likely what they wanted.)
As to why I said it . . . you double-posted. |
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Bookwyrm
Great Reader
USA
4740 Posts |
Posted - 24 Dec 2004 : 08:24:45
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Oops.  Heh. I forgot. You're from Australia. They probably never sold the product there.
Anyone see where I left my brain . . . ? |
Hell hath no fury like all of Candlekeep rising in defense of one of its own.
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31799 Posts |
Posted - 24 Dec 2004 : 15:34:53
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quote:
Originally posted by Bookwyrm
Oops. Heh. I forgot. You're from Australia. They probably never sold the product there.
Anyone see where I left my brain . . . ?
Actually, they did. But it never sold very well, and was eventualy replaced by an Australian-owned concern. But that company didn't bring home the profits either and was eventually absorbed by another company who now make rat poison... .
And now back to the topic...
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Snow
Learned Scribe
USA
125 Posts |
Posted - 06 Jan 2005 : 06:07:30
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quote:
Originally posted by Dargoth
We'll judging by what Rich Baker said it looks like the FR team has no intention of officially assigning the CD domains to any FR deity.
This is true ... he did state that as such over at the WotC boards. But for people who wish to use the additional 3.5 D&D clerical domains that seemingly get added to most new supplement books ... there should be answers.
And that's my current project. Every single dang cleric domain in 3.0 and 3.5 is currently being placed into a database by me. I will be categorically going through each FRCS deity to see which domains match with whom. There is a balancing mechanism that the D&D authors of deity rules use to ensure a balanced *number* of domains per deity power level. I will be using that mechanism.
Sooooo ... hopefully in less than 1 month I will have answers for you.  And I promise to post them here for feedback and everyones enjoyment.
XO,
Snow |
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Bookwyrm
Great Reader
USA
4740 Posts |
Posted - 06 Jan 2005 : 19:21:46
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[::applause::]
Admirable project. I'd started on something similar, but yours sounds so far above mine that I'm pushing it back. By all means, please complete it and give it to Alaundo. I'm quite eager to see this. |
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Alaundo
Head Moderator
United Kingdom
5699 Posts |
Posted - 06 Jan 2005 : 19:46:15
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quote:
Originally posted by Bookwyrm
[::applause::]
Admirable project. I'd started on something similar, but yours sounds so far above mine that I'm pushing it back. By all means, please complete it and give it to Alaundo. I'm quite eager to see this.
Well met
Indeed, I would also like to see the final product and would glady provide a shelf for thee to keep thy scroll here at Candlekeep |
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Lady Kazandra
Senior Scribe
Australia
921 Posts |
Posted - 07 Jan 2005 : 05:27:40
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quote:
Originally posted by Snow
And that's my current project. Every single dang cleric domain in 3.0 and 3.5 is currently being placed into a database by me.
Are you limiting this to just WotC published sourceooks?
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"Once upon a time the plural of 'wizard' was 'war'." -- The Last Continent, by Terry Pratchett |
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warlockco
Master of Realmslore
USA
1695 Posts |
Posted - 07 Jan 2005 : 13:37:23
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quote:
Originally posted by The Sage
quote:
Originally posted by Bookwyrm
Hmm . . . good idea. Ought to do some more FRing, and here's a good place to start.
Offhand, though, Liberation should go to Lliira.
Seems like a good choice.
With a little fudging, I suppose Liberation could also relate to some worshippers of Sune as well. Especially for worshippers who may have been forced into lives of servitude... and have been unable to express themselves fully because of this fact.
Liberation would be a good fit for Sharess. |
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Darth KTrava
Learned Scribe
USA
172 Posts |
Posted - 14 Jan 2005 : 18:47:13
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quote:
Originally posted by Lady Kazandra
quote:
Originally posted by Snow
And that's my current project. Every single dang cleric domain in 3.0 and 3.5 is currently being placed into a database by me.
Are you limiting this to just WotC published sourceooks?
It'd probably be easier. There's already quite a few domains out there that are just published by WOTC alone. And not all DMs would include 3rd party sourcebooks as most probably don't even own them.
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Evil will be dealt with swiftly as it is my duty to remove such evil from my presence.
-Rozhena, Cleric/Divine Champion of Torm |
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Lady Kazandra
Senior Scribe
Australia
921 Posts |
Posted - 15 Jan 2005 : 07:36:27
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quote:
Originally posted by warlockco
quote:
Originally posted by The Sage
quote:
Originally posted by Bookwyrm
Hmm . . . good idea. Ought to do some more FRing, and here's a good place to start.
Offhand, though, Liberation should go to Lliira.
Seems like a good choice.
With a little fudging, I suppose Liberation could also relate to some worshippers of Sune as well. Especially for worshippers who may have been forced into lives of servitude... and have been unable to express themselves fully because of this fact.
Liberation would be a good fit for Sharess.
I don't see that as much. Why would you say that?
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"Once upon a time the plural of 'wizard' was 'war'." -- The Last Continent, by Terry Pratchett |
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warlockco
Master of Realmslore
USA
1695 Posts |
Posted - 15 Jan 2005 : 10:03:33
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quote:
Originally posted by Lady Kazandra
quote:
Originally posted by warlockco
Liberation would be a good fit for Sharess.
I don't see that as much. Why would you say that?
Sharess opposes Set, Shar and Loviatar. She almost became a slave to the darker side of pleasure and subsumed by Shar.
As a goddess of cat, personal freedom is a big item.
Also this text from the Dancer of Sharess PrC lends strength to Sharess having this domain.
quote:
Originally posted by Julia Martin & Eric Haddock in Dragon Magazine
Dancers of Sharess seek pleasure at every opportunity and live life as one endless revel. They value being footloose and fancy free and resist restrictions of any kind—cultural, emotional, mental, or physical—placed on them by others. They love to dance, and most are accomplished singers and play one or more musical instruments. Dancers find evil ugly and repugnant, and they hate undead, viewing them as a violation of the dead’s peaceful rest and an offense against the vibrancy of the positive energy of life.
But Dancers of Sharess also draw from an eclectic set of mandates and traditions passed down through the evolution of their goddess and her church. Their hatred of Set comes from their goddess’s ancient history as Bast, of Vhaeraun from her merger with Zandilar, and of Shar from her captivity by that deity in her recent past as Sharess. Their affiliation with felines also grows from their goddess’s history as Bast, who subsumed Felidae, and their accomplishments in dance from Zandilar the Dancer. Bast also lends them a tradition of fighting skills that few realize exists behind the dancer’s pleasure-sodden existence.
Clerics most often become Dancers of Sharess, with Rangers being less common. Sharess’s philosophy so chafes under restriction that is cannot accommodate the lawful nature of Paladins and Monks.
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Edited by - warlockco on 15 Jan 2005 10:04:43 |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36965 Posts |
Posted - 15 Jan 2005 : 13:49:49
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quote:
Originally posted by Darth KTrava
quote:
Originally posted by Lady Kazandra
quote:
Originally posted by Snow
And that's my current project. Every single dang cleric domain in 3.0 and 3.5 is currently being placed into a database by me.
Are you limiting this to just WotC published sourceooks?
It'd probably be easier. There's already quite a few domains out there that are just published by WOTC alone. And not all DMs would include 3rd party sourcebooks as most probably don't even own them.
I know that I, for one, don't own a single 3rd party sourcebook. There is one I'm trying to obtain, more for the material than for game use. Other than that one, I've no intention of buying any 3rd party stuff. |
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Edited by - Wooly Rupert on 15 Jan 2005 13:51:13 |
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warlockco
Master of Realmslore
USA
1695 Posts |
Posted - 15 Jan 2005 : 16:00:02
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quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
quote:
Originally posted by Darth KTrava
quote:
Originally posted by Lady Kazandra
quote:
Originally posted by Snow
And that's my current project. Every single dang cleric domain in 3.0 and 3.5 is currently being placed into a database by me.
Are you limiting this to just WotC published sourceooks?
It'd probably be easier. There's already quite a few domains out there that are just published by WOTC alone. And not all DMs would include 3rd party sourcebooks as most probably don't even own them.
I know that I, for one, don't own a single 3rd party sourcebook. There is one I'm trying to obtain, more for the material than for game use. Other than that one, I've no intention of buying any 3rd party stuff.
From my experiences with 3rd party material, the majority of their domains are really really stupid (not to say WotC hasn't done so either) but the 3rd party stuff is even worse, or so completely unbalanced it is crazy. |
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SiriusBlack
Great Reader
USA
5517 Posts |
Posted - 15 Jan 2005 : 17:17:44
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quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
I know that I, for one, don't own a single 3rd party sourcebook. There is one I'm trying to obtain, more for the material than for game use. Other than that one, I've no intention of buying any 3rd party stuff.
What is this select one? |
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FRing Complete Divine Domains
